Kramnik should be isolated from the chess world

It was all cause of Kramnik

RIP Danya

Once thing I would add is that Kramnik was PCA World Champion from 2000 to 2006 and it was only in late 2006 that he won the reunification match against Topalov that he then later lost to Anand in 2007. So before then he wasn't FIDE World Champion that was instead Anand (2000), Ponomariov (2002) and Kasimdzhanov (2004). From what I can gather the PCA dissolved in 2006 so I don't think there's any organisation that still exists who could even theoretically strip that title.

Of the 4 GMs to lose their title Alexandru Crisan was the first when he faked it with prearranged results in tournaments he ran. Then Gaioz Nigalidze, Isa Kasimi/Igor Rausis and Kirill Shevchenko are the other 3 to lose their title each due to using engines in tournaments mostly via mobile phones in toilets. I think the 3 who were caught cheating still kept their IM titles.

Then you have one person who was stripped of IM title that is Andrejs Strebkovs who also got a 12 year ban. This was due to harassing dozens of female chess players although Latvian police closed their criminal case against him, stating that his actions did not constitute a crime under Latvian law. FIDE President Arkady Dvorkovich said "This decision sends a strong message that there is no place in chess for such unacceptable behavior. FIDE is committed to safeguarding the rights and dignity of all players, particularly women and minors, who must feel safe and respected in our community."

For inactive players I'm unsure even fines would work since if FIDE says pay the fine or we'll ban you from events you don't play in there isn't much leverage. Probably the thing that has been damaged most is Kramnik's reputation as beforehand he had a veneer of respectability but now next time he tries to post bogus stats I imagine he'll get a lot of abuse.

Kramnik destroyed Danya's reputation and he needs to be punished

I also think Kramnik cheated in his world championship match against Topalov in 2006. his frequent toilet visits were a cover up to hide whatever device / engine he was using. of course, he would claim medical issues and even forbid third parties from entering his toilet to investigate

Maybe we can't physically take Kramnik's titles away from him. But it is our duty as a chess community to banish Kramnik from our minds and souls. As if he no longer exists.
Also, in criminal law, if you do something that is not normally fatal but is fatal to a specific person and you know it, you will be held criminally liable.

@CoffeeBeanKiller said in #1:

Kramnik made a fool of himself quite enough with his multiple unsubstantiated accusations against respected chess players, but now a young man died and he won't stop. A line has been crossed in my opinion. He's not just making a fool of himself anymore, he's toxic and dangerous to the community.

FIDE should suspend him.
He should not receive any invitation to any tournament anymore.
Online chess platforms should close or at least restrict all of his accounts.
Medias should not give him the attention he so desperately craves for.

FIDE will do nothing because it has an incompetent CEO and it's too scared of turning the Russians against it
Ignorant Russians who believed Kramnik blindly

@coledavis said in #11:

@Cedur216

Please refrain from nationalist comments. Not all Russians misbehave, in chess or elsewhere.
As one of my friends in Russia says, "There are no bad nationalities, just bad people".
And I've certainly played against Russian players here.

No his comment was not nationalistic
He's not hating on Russians, but on the Russians who are fans of Kramnik

Kramnik is obviously a great chess player, it's ok if you like his work, but if you don't despise him as a person then there is something seriously wrong with you, unless you live under a rock

Would you also not hate a certain... 'painter' from history, merely because his landscapes were good? Of course you would still hate him right? Anyone who knows a thing about Kramnik should despise him, and if you don't you honestly deserve to be called out

I don't mean to offend anyone with this comment, I'm just sharing my honest opinion

@SD_2709

I try to keep separate the work of art from its creator.
Otherwise, we would take issue with Dickens' life and never experience his work.

Along the same lines, it doesn't make sense to do as some have suggested, and strip Kramnik of any titles that he has earned.
Punishments should fit the crime, not public distaste.

"Would you also not hate a certain... 'painter' from history, merely because his landscapes were good?"
I wish his paintings had been better, then he might have got into the academy in Vienna, and we would be unlikely to have heard of him in the wider social context.

@coledavis said in #29:

@SD_2709

I try to keep separate the work of art from its creator.

That's noble, but when it comes to punishing the creator for their crimes, then we must put the punishment and the question of morality and consequence before the impact on their art

Otherwise, we would take issue with Dickens' life and never experience his work.

Yeah true, I agree that many questionable people have created amazing things... nobody is denying that Vladimir Kramnik is an insanely good chess player, and has achieved an amazing feat

Along the same lines, it doesn't make sense to do as some have suggested, and strip Kramnik of any titles that he has earned.
Punishments should fit the crime, not public distaste.

Yes... but in this case, how would one go about that? Stripping him of his GM titles I agree is not the best fit, but banning him from all future FIDE events as well as major chess websites is appropriate

He earned that title before he played a role in causing someone to take his own life, he can keep that... but he should not be allowed in any event, FIDE, lichess or chesscom, in the future.. atleast for the most part, and absolutely not until he's ready to atleast accept blame

"Would you also not hate a certain... 'painter' from history, merely because his landscapes were good?"
I wish his paintings had been better, then he might have got into the academy in Vienna, and we would be unlikely to have heard of him in the wider social context.

Yes we all wish that, but his actions as a human are louder than his talent as a painter, and while you can respect the latter, in times where they conflict you have to consider that the impact of the former on the majority of people is just much greater, so it's reasonable for them to be angry at him and even his art, especially if they are not able to separate the two as you are