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Fat Fritz 2 is a rip-off

#356

You mean Fraud Fritz :)

You mean Fraud Fritz :)
#358

@DonTomaso I believe the biggest competitors to Chessbase right now are:

@DonTomaso I believe the biggest competitors to Chessbase right now are: - Chess King: Main feature is possibly one of the largest commercial databases they call "GigaKings Games Database": https://chesskingtraining.com/products/chess-king-2021/chess-king-21-download/ - Chess Aquarium: https://shop.chessok.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=7_43&products_id=864&zenid=rvvndffi5nvnoomkgek0e39m11 - Chess Assistant: https://shop.chessok.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=7_54&products_id=853&zenid=rvvndffi5nvnoomkgek0e39m11 - HIARCS Explorer: https://www.hiarcs.com/mac-chess-explorer.htm
#359

There is absolutely nothing that prevents commercialization of GPL. As for FF2, the neural weights are probably not affected by GPL's copyleft and reciprocity. If that's the case, then there is no obligation for them to disclose them. If NNUE net weights can be interpreted as data instead of code then I do not see any strong grounds for GPL violation.

If you call this plagiarism, then look at Oracle Enterprise Linux which is a ripped off from RHEL which is nothing but a curated set of packages created by Redhat based on community contributions. Yet both Oracle and Redhat are earning millions (if not billions) of dollars from these offerings.

What is indeed questionable is the extent of claims made by FF2 and its marketing, but I doubt how much that allegation can hold by itself, if it were brought to court.

And as far as Lichess is concerned, I don't hold them in high respect either. Not due to their opinion in this matter, but because how they handled the pairing changes a few months back. They had deliberately buried the critical discussion threads 15-20 pages deep in the forums. But the community here is too forgetful and patronizing to have an independent and impartial opinion.

There is absolutely nothing that prevents commercialization of GPL. As for FF2, the neural weights are probably not affected by GPL's copyleft and reciprocity. If that's the case, then there is no obligation for them to disclose them. If NNUE net weights can be interpreted as data instead of code then I do not see any strong grounds for GPL violation. If you call this plagiarism, then look at Oracle Enterprise Linux which is a ripped off from RHEL which is nothing but a curated set of packages created by Redhat based on community contributions. Yet both Oracle and Redhat are earning millions (if not billions) of dollars from these offerings. What is indeed questionable is the extent of claims made by FF2 and its marketing, but I doubt how much that allegation can hold by itself, if it were brought to court. And as far as Lichess is concerned, I don't hold them in high respect either. Not due to their opinion in this matter, but because how they handled the pairing changes a few months back. They had deliberately buried the critical discussion threads 15-20 pages deep in the forums. But the community here is too forgetful and patronizing to have an independent and impartial opinion.
#360

Thanks @EricVespene - I've never heard about Chess King before. I was considering Hiarcs a couple of years ago but the new version never seemed to come and their website seemed a bit dated in several ways.

I guess Chess Assistant would be the most natural replacement for me, since I've used it in the past. What is the difference between Chess Assistant and Chess Aquarium?

Thanks @EricVespene - I've never heard about Chess King before. I was considering Hiarcs a couple of years ago but the new version never seemed to come and their website seemed a bit dated in several ways. I guess Chess Assistant would be the most natural replacement for me, since I've used it in the past. What is the difference between Chess Assistant and Chess Aquarium?
#361

@DonTomaso Chess Aquarium seems more modern and sleeker to me? I honestly don't find Assistant intuitive at all. It's GUI looks like it's from the 90's or something. I've never tried Chess King before so don't really know how it compares. I agree with you about HIARCS, seems somewhat limited of a system ... though before the NN engines, it was my fave engine to play against, so I used HIARCS a lot. Ever since NN engines, I like MIA the most and I play that here on LiChess instead.

@DonTomaso Chess Aquarium seems more modern and sleeker to me? I honestly don't find Assistant intuitive at all. It's GUI looks like it's from the 90's or something. I've never tried Chess King before so don't really know how it compares. I agree with you about HIARCS, seems somewhat limited of a system ... though before the NN engines, it was my fave engine to play against, so I used HIARCS a lot. Ever since NN engines, I like MIA the most and I play that here on LiChess instead.
#364

@ChaoticMove you don't hold Lichess to high respect for one tiny issue and simply ignore everything Lichess has done for the community as a whole? How petty can you get?

@ChaoticMove you don't hold Lichess to high respect for one tiny issue and simply ignore everything Lichess has done for the community as a whole? How petty can you get?
#365

Uhh... okay, so when will Lichess switch to using that despicable FatFritz 2? I'm getting tired of StockFish in analysis...

Uhh... okay, so when will Lichess switch to using that despicable FatFritz 2? I'm getting tired of StockFish in analysis...

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