@Blueshirt said in #315:
> Changes should always be about improving something. In this case, I can't see any benefit to this change if it means people will just abort games to get the colour they want. For me, this seems like a backward step and I find taking away people's freedom to choose what colour they play as to be a strange decision.
Yes, right, you can see my aborted games in my profile and you can see the aborted games in other profiles now more often the last days. All here, they do not answer to a rematch request after I aborted a game because of the wrong colour, I think about to give them a temporary visit to my blocklist.
:)))
@BeDecentForAChange said in #312:
> That is the point, weeding out people who exploit preferred game conditions against people who play without these advantageous conditions. That's why they left the option available to invite people under these conditions, so players are aware and have the freedom to choose or decline.
I don't understand the argument. After all, no one is forced to play with a particular person.
I make an offer (with my preferences), and anyone who wants to can accept it under these conditions.
How can this freedom be seen as unfair?
If someone doesn't want to play with me, they simply shouldn't click on me. But if I get clicked on and then see that the game doesn't match my color preference, my only option is to decline! How nonsensical is that?!
Of course, I could specifically invite friends. But for me, the advantage of Lichess has always been connecting with a random player somewhere on this globe. Someone I don't know, who maybe doesn't speak my language, and whom I may never meet again. Still, you could face this person eye to eye and enjoy the most beautiful game in the world for a few minutes: CHESS!
I don't choose my opponents based on their name, country, language, or anything like that, but solely based on their chess preferences and skill level.
I only play black. Yes, it might sound unprofessional, but I've never played white since my childhood. I love blitz games under 2 minutes. When I play white, my reaction time is much higher, and I make far too many mistakes. I want to play black, and I'm sure there are many people who like playing white. I would still look forward to playing with those people. But do I have to ask each one individually now?
Think one step further: Wouldn't it be a great idea if, in the future, even the game variant (Standard, Crazyhouse, etc.) could no longer be selected?! How fair would it be if I had to play Antichess instead of Chess because it’s fairer to my opponent?
I've been a user here for many years, and Lichess was my absolute top choice for leisure, where I also gladly donated as a patron. But now I fear I may hardly be able to play meaningfully here anymore.
What a pity.
@BeDecentForAChange said in #306:
> In the commit message from Thibault, where he removes it from match making (you can still play it with invites or against AI), he notes that it is because the feature is abused to exclusively play with white.
Hello,
can you give us a link to the message the Thibault wrote?
Would be so nice.
@Blueshirt said in #315:
> Changes should always be about improving something. In this case, I can't see any benefit to this change if it means people will just abort games to get the colour they want. For me, this seems like a backward step and I find taking away people's freedom to choose what colour they play as to be a strange decision.
People consistently aborting will be banned, so that will fix itself very quickly.
Before this change, people who played both sides evenly did not have the option of a fair playing field as people abused this feature. The fix is there for fairness and freedom of choice for all, not just the abusers
@teddyd said in #318:
> I don't understand the argument. After all, no one is forced to play with a particular person.
>
> I make an offer (with my preferences), and anyone who wants to can accept it under these conditions.
>
> How can this freedom be seen as unfair?
>
> If someone doesn't want to play with me, they simply shouldn't click on me. But if I get clicked on and then see that the game doesn't match my color preference, my only option is to decline! How nonsensical is that?!
No, as I explained, people who play both sides are automatically matched against open games in the lobby. So if someone who plays both sides opens up a 5+0 game, and there are people in the. 5+0 matchmaking who only play white, the person who plays both sides fairly is forced to play these abusers since they happen to play the same time control. So I could play the same person 25 time and never get white, because they forced me to play black even though I want to matched fairly.
>
> Of course, I could specifically invite friends. But for me, the advantage of Lichess has always been connecting with a random player somewhere on this globe. Someone I don't know, who maybe doesn't speak my language, and whom I may never meet again. Still, you could face this person eye to eye and enjoy the most beautiful game in the world for a few minutes: CHESS!
>
> I don't choose my opponents based on their name, country, language, or anything like that, but solely based on their chess preferences and skill level.
>
> I only play black. Yes, it might sound unprofessional, but I've never played white since my childhood. I love blitz games under 2 minutes. When I play white, my reaction time is much higher, and I make far too many mistakes. I want to play black, and I'm sure there are many people who like playing white. I would still look forward to playing with those people. But do I have to ask each one individually now?
>
> Think one step further: Wouldn't it be a great idea if, in the future, even the game variant (Standard, Crazyhouse, etc.) could no longer be selected?! How fair would it be if I had to play Antichess instead of Chess because it’s fairer to my opponent?
>
That is actually what you were doing to your opponents. You were forcing them to only play you variant and never the other way around. That's like me forcing you to play with a knight down every time we are matched in the same time control.
With this update, I can still **offer** you the option of playing custom settings, but you would have to agree to it in stead of having it forced on you.
> I've been a user here for many years, and Lichess was my absolute top choice for leisure, where I also gladly donated as a patron. But now I fear I may hardly be able to play meaningfully here anymore.
>
Nonsense, you can play just as meaningfully still, just play with both sides a few times and you'll pick it up in no time.
> What a pity.
@goldenCrab said in #317:
> Yes, right, you can see my aborted games in my profile and you can see the aborted games in other profiles now more often the last days. All here, they do not answer to a rematch request after I aborted a game because of the wrong colour, I think about to give them a temporary visit to my blocklist.
>
> :)))
Excessive aborting will result in timeouts and then bans. That's an issue that will sort itself out very quickly
@teddyd said in #318:
> I don't understand the argument. After all, no one is forced to play with a particular person.
>
> I make an offer (with my preferences), and anyone who wants to can accept it under these conditions.
>
> How can this freedom be seen as unfair?
>
> If someone doesn't want to play with me, they simply shouldn't click on me. But if I get clicked on and then see that the game doesn't match my color preference, my only option is to decline! How nonsensical is that?!
>
> Of course, I could specifically invite friends. But for me, the advantage of Lichess has always been connecting with a random player somewhere on this globe. Someone I don't know, who maybe doesn't speak my language, and whom I may never meet again. Still, you could face this person eye to eye and enjoy the most beautiful game in the world for a few minutes: CHESS!
>
> I don't choose my opponents based on their name, country, language, or anything like that, but solely based on their chess preferences and skill level.
>
> I only play black. Yes, it might sound unprofessional, but I've never played white since my childhood. I love blitz games under 2 minutes. When I play white, my reaction time is much higher, and I make far too many mistakes. I want to play black, and I'm sure there are many people who like playing white. I would still look forward to playing with those people. But do I have to ask each one individually now?
>
> Think one step further: Wouldn't it be a great idea if, in the future, even the game variant (Standard, Crazyhouse, etc.) could no longer be selected?! How fair would it be if I had to play Antichess instead of Chess because it’s fairer to my opponent?
>
> I've been a user here for many years, and Lichess was my absolute top choice for leisure, where I also gladly donated as a patron. But now I fear I may hardly be able to play meaningfully here anymore.
>
> What a pity.
You are so right. We should all be able to pick color and the position we want to start in, and then just match people in the same time pool. Every game where I play with black I want to start in the Englund Gambit , after my opponent blunders Bc3. I have played this gambit since my childhood and If I get this position at the start of all my games, I feel comfortable.
We are all here to play Chess, and I deserve the freedom of choice to play this against everyone who plays 5+0 and is paired against me with white. They should not be notified of this beforehand, because that violates my right to play whoever I want with these preferences.
I don't see the harm in this at all since they are not forced to play me, except if they get paired against me without knowing I demand the advantage from the start. I don't discriminate who I play against, as long as it is against everyone and I get this position at the start.
@BeDecentForAChange said in #321:
> No, as I explained, people who play both sides are automatically matched against open games in the lobby. So if someone who plays both sides opens up a 5+0 game, and there are people in the. 5+0 matchmaking who only play white, the person who plays both sides fairly is forced to play these abusers since they happen to play the same time control. So I could play the same person 25 time and never get white, because they forced me to play black even though I want to matched fairly.
Then either the people who play both sides would have to be matched only with people who also want to play both sides.
I really don't understand the argument. Why is someone an “abuser” who has pre-selected their color?
And why should it be unfair to play 25 times against one person and never get white, when I have decided exactly that beforehand, namely that I don't care about the color! Nobody is forcing me, it's my decision. If my decision is “both”, then I can't care! And if I don't care, I'll just choose the color.
I really can't get my head around it...
I am sick of the bootlickers who love authority and think siding with it makes them more just. What a disgusting thread to read and a trash decision from lichess, taking it away even from casual games. I'm too sick of reading this crap.
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