Timer cheats

"Instruct moderators and in general everyone of what is going on in lichess about this issue so people are correctly informed and not just be blamed for reporting a problem. Lichess should give coverage to this initiative so people are informed and take part."

Give me an example of where this is true

also nice essay but my point is essay does not help
a solution and planning one does i will create a new thread for that
As this has clearly gone far beyond the scope

It will be only for defing what we will call solution

@for_cryingout_loud
The examples I will send you in a message not in the forum otherwise it could be considered TOS violation.
My previous post was by far not an essay. The help comes from the community so informing the community will help.
The issue that is about to be tackled is called a project not an essay and so the project has to be defined and project management carried out.
The link to NASA, that will also help
https://nspires.nasaprs.com/external/solicitations/summary!init.do?solId={B364DBB8-390B-744D-013F-8F4C304B9A63}&path=open
There are other links within NASA as well.
Some people working at NASA and also playing chess at lichess can also help but the information of what is being done has to reach them first, that is why publicity is necessary.

Look, I understand the issues we are dealing with here. I am not saying there is a perfect solution. I am simply saying to advertise and offer games as Bullet or Blitz, players MUST be able to know, with accuracy, the amount of actual time on their own clock and that of their opponent. Not to make that possible is essentially cheating players who play fast and manage their time well. I mean, it IS speed chess, after all. If someone has serious lag issues, they always have the option of playing games with a time limit that also adds back a second or five or ten per move. Or they can play standard chess. But to accommodate their slower internet service by giving them back "lag" time is cheating their opponents. The burden should not be on the players who are playing by the letter of the rules to accommodate those who don't or can't. There are Paralympics to accommodate athletes with disabilities. They don't put those athletes in foot races with regular athletes and add ankle weights to regular athletes to "make it fair" for those with disabilities. This lag rule is a ridiculous attempt to fix one seeming inequity by creating another clear one.

lag due to bad connections in some way shape or form
Directly solving lag requires us to fix the internet which is phase 2 after fixing lag comp on lichess

the internet can't be fixed to eliminate lag.

france to australia is about 16000km

if there was a single fibre going direct from france to australia, the lag would be roughly

5u5 * 16000 = 80000us = 80ms or

160ms round trip.

in practice, it's about 270ms round trip as it's not a direct route, which increases latency for a few difference reasons.

I would have thought a lot of lichess users live in the usa, they have roughly 150ms round trip time.

If there was no lag compensation, someone in america with the best internet connection available would be 5 seconds worse off when playing a 40 move game against someone in france. (I just multiplied 150ms by 40 for usa, minus 15ms by 40 for france. it might be the wrong way to do it, idk)

I'm not even sure what this discussion is about now, is it people cheating the lag compensation algorithm or just lag compensation in general?

"make it fair" for those with disabilities. This lag rule is a ridiculous attempt to fix one seeming inequity by creating another clear one.

i agree it does not make it fair but is not giving any help to the ones with lag issues also unfair since now they cant play in faster time controls anymore

to go by your example lag comp is the paralympics helping those who are disabled to play. Now if i understanding you right you want to remove the games from the event. Which is totally fair for them

"MUST be able to know, with accuracy, the amount of actual time on their own clock and that of their opponent"
that requires a perfect solution

also i see we back at the fighting bit yay i love going around in circles

"I'm not even sure what this discussion is about now, is it people cheating the lag compensation algorithm or just lag compensation in general?"-#44

its just fighting about lag and doing nothing

hey this sounds like politics people fighting about issues but not solving them

@h2b2 said in #44:

I'm not even sure what this discussion is about now, is it people cheating the lag compensation algorithm or just lag compensation in general?

It's about the lag compensation itself. Nobody denies it's a good idea, the issue here is that is very badly developed and worst implanted, as it rewards "good/decent/bad" Internet users over "excellent" Internet users, giving away to the first ones even seconds in an entire bullet game.

That's unfair, but the problem here is that a very high percentage of people on this server are "good/decent/bad" Internet users, so Lichess does nothing to sort this issue out.

I'm not a dev, I'm a final user who patrons Lichess because I consider this server one of the best. But also, I see fundamental flaws that most people deny. I'm fed up and I'm done with this subject. It's a waste of time discussing something that never will be sorted out.

Regards.

"so Lichess does nothing to sort this issue out."

Nope the reason nothing is being done is no one has thought of a solution that pleases everyone

It's about the lag compensation itself. Nobody denies it's a good idea, the issue here is that is very badly developed and worst implanted, as it rewards "good/decent/bad" Internet users over "excellent" Internet users, giving away to the first ones even seconds in an entire bullet game.

how have you tested, measured and documented how you tested and measured it in a way that can be reproduced by others?

Just play with increment time and be done with the lag switchers.
See how they never let go the piece and move it around.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyY_77lJrsY