cheating detection

@mkubecek said in #39:

Or I'm just honest enough to admit that it's not as trivial as some people think. And also that the actual reason I lost those games were my own mistakes so that it didn't really matter if my opponents cheated or not.

They get banned before that, which is why I assume they get banned because every rather fresh account that reaches a certain rating (2400? Idk, just guestimate) will get checked, and then its like you say.

Trouble for me is more: they do not get banned when their account is fresh and they are still at "only" 2200 rapid rating.

@Cedur216 said in #38:

"very obvious"

I send you a game, look at it, then tell me again it isnt obvious.

@EvilPyrokar said in #37:

So, u cant spot cheaters while they're in ur face

baically, yes! But I will never tell during the game in the chat. If I have a suspicion, I report them. I recommend you do the same. Some reports lead to a ban (I get a message: "Someone you reported got banned. Thank you!"), some dont.

P.S. I cant send a message to Cedur216 as he doesnt accept any messages. This, however, raises suspicion if he is genuinely interested in discussing topics. Everyone can check that for himself, no messages to him possible.

@Munich said in #42:

P.S. I cant send a message to Cedur216 as he doesnt accept any messages. This, however, raises suspicion if he is genuinely interested in discussing topics. Everyone can check that for himself, no messages to him possible.

I know i too have been trying to reach him about his cars extended warranty.(some people dont want to chat or get spammed with team ads)

When people say someone cheated then the accused should be happy if they didn’t cheat because that means they are playing well!

well, cheating does exist and we do have a report function and let the admins decide if it was cheating.
There are cases, yes, that are obivous, and they often get banned. If people start denying this, I wonder if they ever used the report function.
But some are less obvious, most I'd say. They could be cheating, but they did some inaccuracies during the game. I often have doubts when reporting such cases where there were inaccuracies, but thinking time was uniform, and most most (except for the first few opening moves) are perfect SF moves. I report them if I think they cheated, and some of these cases are confirmed and they get banned, some are not banned, meaning they likely did not cheat (or for the paranoids: there isnt sufficient evidence to ban them for cheating beyond reasonable doubt).

we all can have near perfect games, I had some myself, but anyway, I see no harm in reporting such cases, as long as you do not tell your opponent he was a cheater etc. Just report, and move on.

I still wonder: does anyone know if casual games are worth being reported? do they get checked if reported?
Edit: overlooked #4, its already answered.

@Munich "I still wonder: does anyone know if casual games are worth being reported? do they get checked if reported?"

#4 answered this 10 years ago

Yeah, cheating exists, I even suspect ppl to cheat in the Captchas sometimes. I'm surprised noone ever mentions this.

@Cedur216 said in #38:

@Munich I don't think you're in any place to say "very obvious". This is a plain subjective and self-serving judgement. It holds no relevance for me. As a regular user not only you lack the tools to analyze your opponent's behavior (Irwin / Kaladin / browser telemetry...) but you also lack the knowledge to draw correct conclusions from said tools.
I think this statement is bit of a disservice. I tend to stay away from these discussions just because I have not played online in a couple years. (for reasons of avoiding any paranoia or doubt, my choice). When I did play on cc, the situation went from no cheating noticeable at lower rating levels to insurmountable cheating at club levels. For about the last year I joined the "cheating forum" to see what was being said about it there. While the forum itself is a total bs marketing waste of time, there are people in there who've done some pretty amazing things to track cheating. A pattern I noticed was that generally speaking, folks who suspected cheating were more often than not, right.

Now, without going into technical details about every utility these people had written to analyze games, suffice to say they had credible enough data analysis for me to say with 100% certainty they could pick out who was cheating. Using top players as comparison metrics, and showing graphs over time of move times, etc, it could not have been any more obvious they'd nailed the perpetrators. Yet, none of those utilities are used except by either the guys who wrote them or the people willing to set up the code on their own systems and do analysis themselves.

Personally, while I possess the ability to write just such utilities, and I have all the resources to do it, I have zero interest in sitting around writing code to determine if some online opponent cheated in a game of chess against me. I don't even want to set up someone else's code... Life is too short for this. I saw enough over there to know that it's a cesspool of cheaters, and I have detailed my experiences there, a few times in the forums here. My experience is, while this place might not be perfect, it's 1000% closer to it than over there. I mentioned that over there I tracked a person who had not played an inaccuracy in 2 years, and was undefeated in that time. I'd say that's conclusive, but according to cc, they need more data to be 'sure'.

Some irony is, people claiming this person or that doesn't have enough credentials or ability to accuse a cheater. Yet, we just had a VERY high profile case where the "World Renowned Expert on Chess Cheating" (cc's demigod of cheating analysis) ken regan, said that the games played by Shevchenko show no evidence of cheating. HE'S CONFESSED!!! But he's the "Expert" because he works at a college and he used a laptop to analyze some games years ago... Lmao. They market him as some be-all-end-all opinion, yet he's been involved in every conclusive case of OTB cheating of the past 15 years and not one time has his analysis shown anything... Am I missing something? And just for the record, Fabiano want's to know also because he's said on stream numerous times he's also not a fan. His opinion (paraphrased) is, if you can't show something suspicious in cases where the cheater has confessed, then just go away. He's disparaged all over the internet because of his opinion that online cheating is bad, but on an anonymous account, he couldn't get past 1800 rapid. I'd say if players were legit, he could easily surpass 1800 online, lol.

I believe it was in a recent blog post here where a study was done showing that club level players were more able to pick out cheaters than top level players. It wasn't a huge sample set, but I thought it was profound. I know that early on in my time on cc, I did not notice cheaters even when they beat me and were banned. Later on, I was far more suspicious. In some cases there wasn't any doubt, but I never reported a single time. Time proved me right on the cases I'd followed till I left, but I closed my acct and left and I only looked back one time since at the one account mentioned above. All trace of that account is gone, of course so is mine I closed. So, hey, 3 years of undefeated play evidently does throw up a red flag over there, even if 2 years doesn't. That's progress! What do they say, "Best cheat detection in the world!" Lmao. I say they underwrite cheating over there...

@Munich said in #7:

My question isnt about me or any specific opponent, but I think that a few weeks or months ago, many of my reports resulted in a ban, and quite quickly.

Perhaps no one has reported you? Longer time controls mean more accuracy due to more time to actually think before moving.
And the better the player, those numbers just increase. Thats the nature of higher level play. Deal with it, thats how it works.

@Alientcp said in #49:

Perhaps no one has reported you?

for what?