cheating detection

@mkubecek said in #20:

And yet you treat them as such. :-(

watch your tone! Or we cant seriously discuss this.

@Munich said in #19:

I prefer opponents with a stable rating, it just gives me peace of mind.
I'm pretty sure those new users would also prefer having a stable rating. But the tricky part is: how are they supposed to make their rating stable if players with stable rating refuse to play against them?

@Munich said in #21:

watch your tone! Or we cant seriously discuss this.
That has nothing to do with tone. On one hand you admit that majority of users (including new accounts) are not cheaters; on the other, you automatically treat opponents with unstable rating as potential cheaters and go as far as aborting games whenever you see one. (Or at least you say you do.) I just pointed it out, that's all.

@mkubecek said in #22:

But the tricky part is: how are they supposed to make their rating stable if players with stable rating refuse to play against them?

ye, thats the sad thing about it.

I clearly failed to convince you that your behaviour is bad and that you should stop. Hopefully the temporary playbans will once they are long enough. Until then, I can only feel sorry for your opponents.

@Munich said in #21:

watch your tone! Or we cant seriously discuss this.

Here's a suggestion: drop your self-serving bias. Whoosh! No more cheat paranoia!

@Cedur216 said in #26:

Here's a suggestion: drop your self-serving bias. Whoosh! No more cheat paranoia!

I doubt you read all this before? The whole threat isnt about cheating and accusations, but rather about cheating detection. There was an unusual delay in reporting and bans. But this thread seem to have speed up the process, at least in my case, I already got a message that one of the games I report resulted in a ban. I was wondering. There is probably currently a lot in the detection queue going on, and all I can say to those who waited like me for ages: keep patient, eventually your report will be looked at.

Maybe more admins are needed to help get rid of the queue, but how to apply for such honorable job is certainly worth a new thread, not this one.

And I asked this already: does anyone know if casual games are checked? or should I not bother reporting if I think I played a cheater but it was a casual game, as casual games appear not to get checked? Which will result in me not playing casual games anymore unless it is a known friend.

@Munich said in #27:

There was an unusual delay in reporting and bans. But this thread seem to have speed up the process
Highly unlikely.

how to apply for such honorable job is certainly worth a new thread, not this one
No need for a thread, it's already answered in the FAQ: https://lichess.org/faq#mod-application

@mkubecek said in #25:

failed to convince you that your behaviour is bad

No, you did fail. I know it is bad for freshers. Then again, I do not like to be the punching bag of cheaters who got banned and respawn. Worse: those who get reported and banned sense it was me who reported them, then they respawn and cheat me again, just to annoy me and say "see? reporting me doesnt stop me".
How I know? in one case the respawned user had a similar name (when checking I realized this after the game). Since I can not remember whom I played and reported and who got banned, it is simplest for me not to play freshers. One game doesnt make a great statistic. But ye, it happened once, and it is to some extend "understandable" if I try it to see it from the point of view of a cheater. (though I dont understand what the fun of cheating is in the first place, sorry).

One speculation I have is that it is more rewarding to cheat a higher rated player (more elo points gained), and thus players above 2000 rating are more prone to fresh respawned players. you dont need to cheat that often if you cheat only higher rated players. Then, when players think they have reached the rating the "deserve" they stop cheating. But.... that's pure speculation. could be, could not be.

Others might share their experience.

@Munich said in #27:

The whole threat isnt about cheating and accusations, but rather about cheating detection. There was an unusual delay in reporting and bans

Have you considered that some of your reports are probably wrong ? If you can detect cheaters just by playing one game and looking at their account, with no false positives or negatives, you should knock at the door of chesscom , they could pay you good money just for detecting cheaters in titled Tuesdays. I mean I believe cheating is a big problem in online chess (probably OTB too) but if, as you say, cheaters just make a new account, they are only going to get better at not being detected. What I do is I keep a notepad with suspicious accounts and I check after a while. Many are banned. Many others not. Yesterday I reported someone after a very strange game where we reached equal endgame in move 23, I had 5 minutes opponent 6 seconds (+5) he played 40 moves until I also got in time trouble and blundered. I look his account and he has your usual suspect 97% ACC wins , also defeats where he was winning and one move loses the game (avoid detection attempt ?) and also, wait for it, a "cheat detected" defeat that he auto lost. He is still playing. But you have to live with it, because there's truly no solution, fortunately I think it's 1 cheater every 20 games or so, which is quite playable. Over there in chesscom where many players just don't give a monkey hair about chess, I think it's more usual that players turn on the engine for giggles. Here I think it's curiosity about cheat detection (as you are showing, watch out for the dark side as they said), wanting to play titled players, thinking everyone is cheating and turning cheats on to punish the alleged cheater, so careful, obsessing with cheating will end up with you a cheater or you quitting. My opinion: it's still playable. Both main sites. Still people. Keep enjoying, report if you think so, but don't go to the forum asking about your report. (The notepad of shame could be an option) . Cheers.