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People who cant solve mate in 4 moves?

#1

Hi, people

I like to think I'm in a 1 category or expert level, about 1800-2000. But I have a big problem: I cant solve study mate in 3 or 4 moves.

My calculation skill is very poor, I play mainlly by intuition and I can calculation just easy variations like that in common tactics on chesstempo or lichess.

My question is: how someone can reach a expert level without calculation? That is normal? Because I find players who can calculation much more than me with less rating... I dont understand very well what that means..

Someone do want write some words if know something about that?

"Somehow, players seem to believe that ‘everyone else’ can see two moves ahead with ease, and they’re embarrassed to admit how difficult it may be for them! Most club players have a similar fallacy about opening preparation: they imagine that studying openings is the key to improvement, and that ‘everyone else’ knows their openings cold; while in reality 95% of club games are decided by who does a better job of calculating variations and avoiding blunders." - Hertan, Charles - Forcing Chess Moves - The Key to Better Calculation 3rd

I admit how difficult is for me see two/three moves ahead if they are from a complex postion...

Hi, people I like to think I'm in a 1 category or expert level, about 1800-2000. But I have a big problem: I cant solve study mate in 3 or 4 moves. My calculation skill is very poor, I play mainlly by intuition and I can calculation just easy variations like that in common tactics on chesstempo or lichess. My question is: how someone can reach a expert level without calculation? That is normal? Because I find players who can calculation much more than me with less rating... I dont understand very well what that means.. Someone do want write some words if know something about that? "Somehow, players seem to believe that ‘everyone else’ can see two moves ahead with ease, and they’re embarrassed to admit how difficult it may be for them! Most club players have a similar fallacy about opening preparation: they imagine that studying openings is the key to improvement, and that ‘everyone else’ knows their openings cold; while in reality 95% of club games are decided by who does a better job of calculating variations and avoiding blunders." - Hertan, Charles - Forcing Chess Moves - The Key to Better Calculation 3rd I admit how difficult is for me see two/three moves ahead if they are from a complex postion...
#2

I'm a mediocre 1800 ish rated player. I have played 4k+ games on lichess and the amount of games played has an impact on my calculation. However, i suck at mate in 4 sort of puzzles. Are you conducting some sort of surveys? https://lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/test-your-board-visualization-level-look-inside

I'm a mediocre 1800 ish rated player. I have played 4k+ games on lichess and the amount of games played has an impact on my calculation. However, i suck at mate in 4 sort of puzzles. Are you conducting some sort of surveys? https://lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/test-your-board-visualization-level-look-inside
#3

There are mate in 3 or 4 problems which puzzle me for hours...

There are mate in 3 or 4 problems which puzzle me for hours...
#4

@NoobBatter yes, I would like know the mind of players in 1 category/expert level...

I am currently convinced that true skill in chess is the ability to combine two or more pieces to create a defense or an attack. I think this is related to the ability to see the arrangement of the pieces. I believe that players like me are just imitators, we play a certain amount of games and we study something and we reproduce what we remember.

Players like me have a static mind and people with natural talent have a dynamic mind which may or may not be accompanied by studies.

I dont know, I think that is because lack of mental stamina... People who dont have too much energy dont like wast it all time... Our brain avoids fatigue and creates habits where it can solve problems through memory: the imitator player!

@NoobBatter yes, I would like know the mind of players in 1 category/expert level... I am currently convinced that true skill in chess is the ability to combine two or more pieces to create a defense or an attack. I think this is related to the ability to see the arrangement of the pieces. I believe that players like me are just imitators, we play a certain amount of games and we study something and we reproduce what we remember. Players like me have a static mind and people with natural talent have a dynamic mind which may or may not be accompanied by studies. I dont know, I think that is because lack of mental stamina... People who dont have too much energy dont like wast it all time... Our brain avoids fatigue and creates habits where it can solve problems through memory: the imitator player!
#5

Playing chess well is about gathering chunks. Amateurs have say 1.000, experts 10k, GMs 50k, MC 100k. Age plays an important role, it’s crucial for the max.

Just practicing and collecting chess content thus accumulating chunks and increasing your pool!

Good news: it is not Black Magic
Bad News: it is Hard Work

(If you don’t like the word chunks call it patterns, experience or whatever you like.)

Playing chess well is about gathering chunks. Amateurs have say 1.000, experts 10k, GMs 50k, MC 100k. Age plays an important role, it’s crucial for the max. Just practicing and collecting chess content thus accumulating chunks and increasing your pool! Good news: it is not Black Magic Bad News: it is Hard Work (If you don’t like the word chunks call it patterns, experience or whatever you like.)
#6

@Sarg0n I know about pattern/schemes... In some sense all one can to do is read books like Thinking in Schemes or Art of Attack or practice tactics online...

But I like compare chess to football (soccer). It is possible train on gym, gain muscles, speed, flexbility, train jump.. after someone can train some play tecniques... At end that guy can be An efficient player. Howrever, there is something can be not learned, that is all about criativity or imagination...

I dont know, some theorists believe all ability can be trained, others, no. I think that have something to do with mind energy...

Kasparov has an incredible knowledge in chess and he can still remember this knowledge, but he can no longer play competitively because he is no longer able to think deeply about positions. That said, maybe what Kasparov has now is what weaker players have even when he's still young, maybe there's a lack of mental vigor! That energy is necessary to criativity and imagination... With no criativity or imagination the player depend ons memory, just memory: that is my actual theory!

@Sarg0n I know about pattern/schemes... In some sense all one can to do is read books like Thinking in Schemes or Art of Attack or practice tactics online... But I like compare chess to football (soccer). It is possible train on gym, gain muscles, speed, flexbility, train jump.. after someone can train some play tecniques... At end that guy can be An efficient player. Howrever, there is something can be not learned, that is all about criativity or imagination... I dont know, some theorists believe all ability can be trained, others, no. I think that have something to do with mind energy... Kasparov has an incredible knowledge in chess and he can still remember this knowledge, but he can no longer play competitively because he is no longer able to think deeply about positions. That said, maybe what Kasparov has now is what weaker players have even when he's still young, maybe there's a lack of mental vigor! That energy is necessary to criativity and imagination... With no criativity or imagination the player depend ons memory, just memory: that is my actual theory!
#8

I had a Nokia phone with some checkmate puzzles and some mate-in-2 puzzles could be very difficult to solve.

With a king near the center of the board and 8 possible flight square, some of which maybe capture a piece that you might want to use to deliver the final mate, protect another or prevent further flight, and combinations of enemy pieces which could block checks (to make the route to mate longer) or capture a checking piece or create further flight squares, ...
knowing which move could force a mate against all possible replies was not always easy.

Suppose the first move of a mate-in-two is not a check. Then you have to have a mating response to every possible reply and just a reply by an opposing queen in the middle of the board could be 27 things to look at.

I am prepared to look dumb here so that some others don't feel so bad, but mate-in-two can be pretty hard to see. And remember, Fisher himself could miss mate it one over the board!

I had a Nokia phone with some checkmate puzzles and some mate-in-2 puzzles could be very difficult to solve. With a king near the center of the board and 8 possible flight square, some of which maybe capture a piece that you might want to use to deliver the final mate, protect another or prevent further flight, and combinations of enemy pieces which could block checks (to make the route to mate longer) or capture a checking piece or create further flight squares, ... knowing which move could force a mate against all possible replies was not always easy. Suppose the first move of a mate-in-two is not a check. Then you have to have a mating response to every possible reply and just a reply by an opposing queen in the middle of the board could be 27 things to look at. I am prepared to look dumb here so that some others don't feel so bad, but mate-in-two can be pretty hard to see. And remember, Fisher himself could miss mate it one over the board!
#9

@livro-dos-dias You are probably a better player than me, but still I can solve some mate in 7 and you struggle with mate in 4. Why? Because I I don't play blitz. Once you solve those tactics in slow time controls you will be able to do it in fast games too. It is clear that you have to play with intuition in fast games. How do you want to practice calculation this way? Also you can work on your visualization skills = imagining how the board will look like in a couple of moves.

@livro-dos-dias You are probably a better player than me, but still I can solve some mate in 7 and you struggle with mate in 4. Why? Because I I don't play blitz. Once you solve those tactics in slow time controls you will be able to do it in fast games too. It is clear that you have to play with intuition in fast games. How do you want to practice calculation this way? Also you can work on your visualization skills = imagining how the board will look like in a couple of moves.
#10

A key element to understand is that a combinaison in a real game does not appear by magic.

Generally if you have 3 pieces or 4 against alone king there must be something to search here.

What is more important is to develop your pieces in the opening phase and in the middle game improve your pieces, trade your bad one against your opponent good one ... My point is tactics are just the final point of a good strategic plan.

So you can be a great 1900 player that suck at 4 moves mate but you are great at allowing this king of tactic to appear in your game.

It is far better that just playing for tricks all the time.

If you take a 1500 elo player with let's say a good startegic fondation that allow him to have the appearance of a winning tactic of 30 % he might see and excecute that tactic around 50 % correctly (because he sees it, sometimes not, sometimes he sees it but did the wrong move order ..)

But indeed if you want to improve and become a 2200 ... player you will need to improve your tactic so when you have one you do not miss it !!!

2 key factors: How to have a tactic in a game ?

How to solve that tactic ?

These is 2 differents skills that are complementary.

Perhaps you are at 1900 with skill one and 1600 with skill 2.

Some player at 2200 can be extremely good at stategy with 2400 and "suck" at 1900 in tactic or you can have the opposite profil with a beast in tactic with 2400 and a 2000 player in stategy.

Depending on your strenght or weakenesses you can adopt different opening to maximize your stronger skills.

A key element to understand is that a combinaison in a real game does not appear by magic. Generally if you have 3 pieces or 4 against alone king there must be something to search here. What is more important is to develop your pieces in the opening phase and in the middle game improve your pieces, trade your bad one against your opponent good one ... My point is tactics are just the final point of a good strategic plan. So you can be a great 1900 player that suck at 4 moves mate but you are great at allowing this king of tactic to appear in your game. It is far better that just playing for tricks all the time. If you take a 1500 elo player with let's say a good startegic fondation that allow him to have the appearance of a winning tactic of 30 % he might see and excecute that tactic around 50 % correctly (because he sees it, sometimes not, sometimes he sees it but did the wrong move order ..) But indeed if you want to improve and become a 2200 ... player you will need to improve your tactic so when you have one you do not miss it !!! 2 key factors: How to have a tactic in a game ? How to solve that tactic ? These is 2 differents skills that are complementary. Perhaps you are at 1900 with skill one and 1600 with skill 2. Some player at 2200 can be extremely good at stategy with 2400 and "suck" at 1900 in tactic or you can have the opposite profil with a beast in tactic with 2400 and a 2000 player in stategy. Depending on your strenght or weakenesses you can adopt different opening to maximize your stronger skills.

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