@Hierophantc4 My comment that you reference was in earnest, however your response wasn't directed to me, only addressed at me. So the assumption in post #19 is correct, but your follow up wasn't. If you're don't being insulted by your interpretation, get back to the topic.
@Hierophantc4 My comment that you reference was in earnest, however your response wasn't directed to me, only addressed at me. So the assumption in post #19 is correct, but your follow up wasn't. If you're don't being insulted by your interpretation, get back to the topic.
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I am always surprised when someone promotes the Bird, but makes no mention of the From Gambit. In your case you have one sentence, saying 'white ought to be fine' or something like that. I play nothing but the From against the Bird, and I have won more than I lost, which, with black, suits me.
I don't say that the From refutes the Bird. From works because 1) the Bird player is looking for a particular kind of game, and is forced to play a totally different kind, and
2) Many Bird players ignore the From, as if it is nothing, and thus have no idea how to respond
My one piece of advice, If you are going to play the Bird, you better have a plan for meeting the From
I will include a sample game in my next post. I messed up and can't get it in now.
I am always surprised when someone promotes the Bird, but makes no mention of the From Gambit. In your case you have one sentence, saying 'white ought to be fine' or something like that. I play nothing but the From against the Bird, and I have won more than I lost, which, with black, suits me.
I don't say that the From refutes the Bird. From works because 1) the Bird player is looking for a particular kind of game, and is forced to play a totally different kind, and
2) Many Bird players ignore the From, as if it is nothing, and thus have no idea how to respond
My one piece of advice, If you are going to play the Bird, you better have a plan for meeting the From
I will include a sample game in my next post. I messed up and can't get it in now.
https://lichess.org/cju7waHuX0ux
I almost lost on time, as is my habit. An early g2-g3 was probably white's best idea.I don't know how to become a member of your study, so I have to post here.
https://lichess.org/cju7waHuX0ux
I almost lost on time, as is my habit. An early g2-g3 was probably white's best idea.
I don't know how to become a member of your study, so I have to post here.
@sparowe14 You appear to be mistaken: I have a chapter that covers the mainline and some key defensive ideas, as well as placeholder chapters that will cover important sidelines. Additionally, I never said "White ought to be fine," but did write multiple sentences and paragraphs on it including the phrase "Black will never equalize." From's Gambit is fundamentally unsound and anti-positional, engine analysis even implies that the Lasker Variation offers less-than-no compensation on balance.
However, I'm being too radical. From's Gambit does have practical surprise value and it doesn't matter if it's objectively bad if your human opponent is likely to blunder against it. You're absolutely right that I do need to include more From's Gambit coverage. I will be expanding it, particularly over the next month as I prepare for an upcoming tournament. I'm criminally optimistic and entertaining the delusion that I might be able to take down one of the weaker masters by flipping The Bird after playing 1. g3 up to that point.
I just find more critical, mainline deviations such as 3. c4 or 6... Re8 7. Nc3 more interesting and enjoyable to study.
@sparowe14 You appear to be mistaken: I have a chapter that covers the mainline and some key defensive ideas, as well as placeholder chapters that will cover important sidelines. Additionally, I never said "White ought to be fine," but did write multiple sentences and paragraphs on it including the phrase "Black will never equalize." From's Gambit is fundamentally unsound and anti-positional, engine analysis even implies that the Lasker Variation offers less-than-no compensation on balance.
However, I'm being too radical. From's Gambit does have practical surprise value and it doesn't matter if it's objectively bad if your human opponent is likely to blunder against it. You're absolutely right that I do need to include more From's Gambit coverage. I will be expanding it, particularly over the next month as I prepare for an upcoming tournament. I'm criminally optimistic and entertaining the delusion that I might be able to take down one of the weaker masters by flipping The Bird after playing 1. g3 up to that point.
I just find more critical, mainline deviations such as 3. c4 or 6... Re8 7. Nc3 more interesting and enjoyable to study.
@Triangel I have a number of lines on 1... Nc6. Since Black typically plays for a quick e5 break, I recommend that White play for a stonewall formation as this punishes Black for blocking the c-pawn and playing d7-d6, the typical plan. I played this entertaining, but dubious game with it awhile back.
https://lichess.org/ZLKDnME4#109
@Triangel I have a number of lines on 1... Nc6. Since Black typically plays for a quick e5 break, I recommend that White play for a stonewall formation as this punishes Black for blocking the c-pawn and playing d7-d6, the typical plan. I played this entertaining, but dubious game with it awhile back. https://lichess.org/ZLKDnME4#109
@ChiefChem Thank you! My personal favorite lines are the weird ones that occur when Black opts for an unconventional defense such as ...b6.
@ChiefChem Thank you! My personal favorite lines are the weird ones that occur when Black opts for an unconventional defense such as ...b6.
@Hierophanyc4 The Bird player only needs about five or six ideas to neutralize the From. It's encouraging, from my point of view, to see how many don't have those ideas. The From is almost entirely based on exploiting the weak h4 - e8 diagonal, or as a fall-back position, blowing open the h-file. The necessary precautions for white are easy to learn if the dangers are recognized.
Modern theory says black should play solid against the 'flank' Bird but I cling to my idea of mixing it up from move 2 or 3, hoping for favorable complications.
I commend you on the vision of a 'handbook' for playing the Bird. If I can find it I will share a very old game where I opened 1 f4 and got a quick checkmate by pulling black's king into the open. But probably the score sheet is as elusive as my memory.
@Hierophanyc4 The Bird player only needs about five or six ideas to neutralize the From. It's encouraging, from my point of view, to see how many don't have those ideas. The From is almost entirely based on exploiting the weak h4 - e8 diagonal, or as a fall-back position, blowing open the h-file. The necessary precautions for white are easy to learn if the dangers are recognized.
Modern theory says black should play solid against the 'flank' Bird but I cling to my idea of mixing it up from move 2 or 3, hoping for favorable complications.
I commend you on the vision of a 'handbook' for playing the Bird. If I can find it I will share a very old game where I opened 1 f4 and got a quick checkmate by pulling black's king into the open. But probably the score sheet is as elusive as my memory.
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@sparowe14 There are a few good defenses against Bird's Opening. You can play in a hypermodern fashion with quite some success, as 1... b6 works well thanks to the way that f4 weakens e4. Then, there are ambitious lines that don't entail dramatic concessions, such as 6... Re8 with the threat of a very early e5. f4 d5 Nf3 Bg4 will lead you to either a better position, a pawn sacrifice that's something like an improved, less theoretical version of From's Gambit, or an opposite sides castles game reminiscent of a Sicilian.
My recommendations for Black to play against Bird's Opening are
#1: f4 d5 Nf3 g6 so on and so on, either proceeding with the main line or the 6... Re8 move. Certainly best, but the positions get quite complicated and the Bird player will be more experienced than you in them.
#2: 1. f4 d5 2. Nf3 Bg4 3. e3 Nd7 4. h3! Bxf3 5. Qxf3 e5!?. White can easily make a mistake before reaching this point, and even masters frequently play sub-par moves from the White side. This pawn sacrifice is something of a final attempt to complicate and hope for a win. It's also considerably trickier to refute than From's Gambit, from my point of view.
#3: 1. f4 d5 2. Nf3 Bg4 3. e3 Nd7 4. h3 Bxf3 5. Qxf3 c6. The same trick potential in the first few moves, but in this case Black settles for an untheoretical, dynamic position where both sides can embark on many choices of strategy.
My friend @seanh7532 is my number one 'Bird student' and when we play against each other, the last line is his favorite and what he uses against me. You can see it in action below:
https://lichess.org/5W7u2YGX/black
@sparowe14 There are a few good defenses against Bird's Opening. You can play in a hypermodern fashion with quite some success, as 1... b6 works well thanks to the way that f4 weakens e4. Then, there are ambitious lines that don't entail dramatic concessions, such as 6... Re8 with the threat of a very early e5. f4 d5 Nf3 Bg4 will lead you to either a better position, a pawn sacrifice that's something like an improved, less theoretical version of From's Gambit, or an opposite sides castles game reminiscent of a Sicilian.
My recommendations for Black to play against Bird's Opening are
#1: f4 d5 Nf3 g6 so on and so on, either proceeding with the main line or the 6... Re8 move. Certainly best, but the positions get quite complicated and the Bird player will be more experienced than you in them.
#2: 1. f4 d5 2. Nf3 Bg4 3. e3 Nd7 4. h3! Bxf3 5. Qxf3 e5!?. White can easily make a mistake before reaching this point, and even masters frequently play sub-par moves from the White side. This pawn sacrifice is something of a final attempt to complicate and hope for a win. It's also considerably trickier to refute than From's Gambit, from my point of view.
#3: 1. f4 d5 2. Nf3 Bg4 3. e3 Nd7 4. h3 Bxf3 5. Qxf3 c6. The same trick potential in the first few moves, but in this case Black settles for an untheoretical, dynamic position where both sides can embark on many choices of strategy.
My friend @seanh7532 is my number one 'Bird student' and when we play against each other, the last line is his favorite and what he uses against me. You can see it in action below: https://lichess.org/5W7u2YGX/black