https://lichess.org/C9LEmnpI#1
Here is the game
I ultimately won the game, but to be honest I don't think I did a very good job converting. I am a little confused though on what realistically I could have done since very high level tactics seem to be required in order to convert, outside of my opponent blundering.
I had a winning advantage for the bulk of the game, and thought I was better while playing as well, but didn't really capitalize off of it until my opponent made the terrible 37 Ra8 move followed by an also terrible Bd6.
Most obvious mistake is hanging a pawn right before this and I should be weary of that in the future.
My biggest advantage pre my opponent hanging the bishop was on move 17 where I could have played Bxf7 which is about 2 points better than the second best move. I honestly don't even quite understand how this wins just by looking at the move, but every computer line ends up with a winning advantage.
A similarly tough to spot tactic happens on move 29 where my best option is to play Nh4 just giving up the knight to weaken the king.
On move 18 I can sack the exchange which wins a pawn and leads to a fork, this is also really hard to spot
On move 25 I can play Bxe6, the only move that gives white a win according to the computer, which is also seemingly a very advanced move.
To be honest most of these tactics seem way out of reach, (although correct me if I am wrong maybe they seem simple to you) so what ways of converting do you think are the easiest to digest and implement in future games for someone of roughly my elo?
I know generic advice is just to do more puzzles and increase tactical awareness but tbh a lot of these tactics feel like they have to be master level lol
Thank you :)
https://lichess.org/C9LEmnpI#1
Here is the game
I ultimately won the game, but to be honest I don't think I did a very good job converting. I am a little confused though on what realistically I could have done since very high level tactics seem to be required in order to convert, outside of my opponent blundering.
I had a winning advantage for the bulk of the game, and thought I was better while playing as well, but didn't really capitalize off of it until my opponent made the terrible 37 Ra8 move followed by an also terrible Bd6.
Most obvious mistake is hanging a pawn right before this and I should be weary of that in the future.
My biggest advantage pre my opponent hanging the bishop was on move 17 where I could have played Bxf7 which is about 2 points better than the second best move. I honestly don't even quite understand how this wins just by looking at the move, but every computer line ends up with a winning advantage.
A similarly tough to spot tactic happens on move 29 where my best option is to play Nh4 just giving up the knight to weaken the king.
On move 18 I can sack the exchange which wins a pawn and leads to a fork, this is also really hard to spot
On move 25 I can play Bxe6, the only move that gives white a win according to the computer, which is also seemingly a very advanced move.
To be honest most of these tactics seem way out of reach, (although correct me if I am wrong maybe they seem simple to you) so what ways of converting do you think are the easiest to digest and implement in future games for someone of roughly my elo?
I know generic advice is just to do more puzzles and increase tactical awareness but tbh a lot of these tactics feel like they have to be master level lol
Thank you :)
You play too fast. This is a 15+0 rapid game. Most chess games are essentially decided by move 30. That means you should play at about 30 seconds per move. You played as if it were a 5+0 blitz game.
When you solve tactics puzzles, how many seconds do you use per puzzle?
Switch to 15+10 with increment and spend 40 seconds per move and finish the game on increment. Take time to think.
13 Bxf7+ Kxf7 14 Qd2 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
14 Rxd6 Qxd6 15 Nxe5 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
19 Rd2? throws away your advantage. 19 Qc4 was the way to hold on to your advantage, but you spent only 6 seconds.
You play too fast. This is a 15+0 rapid game. Most chess games are essentially decided by move 30. That means you should play at about 30 seconds per move. You played as if it were a 5+0 blitz game.
When you solve tactics puzzles, how many seconds do you use per puzzle?
Switch to 15+10 with increment and spend 40 seconds per move and finish the game on increment. Take time to think.
13 Bxf7+ Kxf7 14 Qd2 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
14 Rxd6 Qxd6 15 Nxe5 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
19 Rd2? throws away your advantage. 19 Qc4 was the way to hold on to your advantage, but you spent only 6 seconds.
@tpr said in #2:
... This is a 15+0 rapid game. ...
The
https://lichess.org/C9LEmnpI
39 move game (~2 days ago), between Jclouds512 and Prakash_Karamala, was a 15+10 game.
@tpr said in #2:
... 13 Bxf7+ Kxf7 14 Qd2 is the fastest way to win ...
13 Bxf7+ would not have been a legal move. Probably, tpr was thinking of 17 Bxf7+.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
... My biggest advantage pre my opponent hanging the bishop was on move 17 where I could have played Bxf7 which is about 2 points better than the second best move. I honestly don't even quite understand how this wins just by looking at the move, but every computer line ends up with a winning advantage. ...
The thing about 17 Bxf7+ Kxf7 18 Qd2 is that it does not seem that Prakash_Karamala would have had anything acceptable to do about the danger to the d6-bishop. Perhaps the clue that might have helped Jclouds512 to spot this possibility is that 16...c6 eliminated the pawn's protection of the bishop.
@tpr said in #2:
... you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
As I read it, Jclouds512 used ~19 seconds to choose 17 Bb3, but it should be noted that the first 17 moves were played at an average rate that would have been appropriate if it had been expected that the game would last for 196 moves.
@tpr said in #2:
14 Rxd6 Qxd6 15 Nxe5 is the fastest way to win ...
14 Rxd6 would also have not been legal. 18 Rxd6 Qxd6 19 Nxe5 would, right off, have won a bishop and a pawn for the rook and created the follow-up danger of 20 Nxf7, simultaneously attacking Prakash_Karamala's queen and h8-rook.
@tpr said in #2:
... you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
Again, as near as I can tell, ~19 seconds were used to choose 18 Ba2, and it DID preserve some advantage.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
... On move 18 I can sack the exchange which wins a pawn and leads to a fork, this is also really hard to spot ...
I wonder if 18 Rxd6 was considered.
@tpr said in #2:
19 Rd2? throws away your advantage. 19 Qc4 was the way to hold on to your advantage, but you spent only 6 seconds.
As far as I can tell, ~64 seconds were used to choose 19 Rd2 which DID retain some advantage. Of course, 19 Qc4 would have been a lot better, and I wonder if Jclouds512 considered it.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
... On move 25 I can play Bxe6, the only move that gives white a win according to the computer, which is also seemingly a very advanced move. ...
Apparently, only ~10 seconds were used by Jclouds512 to choose 25 Bg3. At that point, Jclouds512 could have decided to use an average of 20 seconds per move and had enough time to last up to move 87.
I am not sure why Jclouds512 regards 25 Bxe6 as an advanced move. It DOES appear that 25 Bxe6 would have been the only option good enough for an immediate winning advantage, but it seems that 25 Rd7 would also have been an improvement on the choice that Jclouds512 made.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
... tough to spot tactic happens on move 29 where my best option is to play Nh4 just giving up the knight to weaken the king. ...
During the ~3 seconds that Jclouds512 spent choosing 28 Qb3, I wonder if consideration was given to 28 Qe2 (with the hope of eventually playing Qh5)?
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
... To be honest most of these tactics seem way out of reach, (although correct me if I am wrong maybe they seem simple to you) so what ways of converting do you think are the easiest to digest and implement in future games for someone of roughly my elo?
I know generic advice is just to do more puzzles and increase tactical awareness but tbh a lot of these tactics feel like they have to be master level lol ...
I do not think that moves like 17 Bxf7+ and 18 Rxd6 are simple to find, but I also think that it would be a mistake to regard them as out of reach to anyone below master level. There were clues in the position to suggest their viability.
I know someone who once suggested playing through every single Morphy game. That would perhaps be overdoing it, but Jclouds512 might find it to be a mind-expanding experience to work through A First Book of Morphy.
@tpr said in #2:
You play too fast. ...
It seems quite possible that rushing was a factor in the failure to play moves like 28 Qe2, 25 Bxe6, or 25 Rd7.
19 Rd2 (and 13 a3 instead of 13 Nd5) may not have been rush decisions, but they do look like they may have been the result of failures to consider aggressive options.
@tpr said in #2:
... Switch to 15+10 with increment and spend 40 seconds per move and finish the game on increment. ...
That seems to be a suggestion to average 40 seconds per move for the first 30 moves and subsequently try to survive on the 10 second increments.
"... everyone is different, so what works for one person may likely fail with another ..." - NM Dan Heisman (2002)
https://web.archive.org/web/20140627084053/http://www.chesscafe.com/text/heisman19.pdf
As 19 Rd2 indicates, 40 seconds is no guarantee of a quality move. I suspect that many players will often fail to reach an easily won position after 30 moves against an opponent who perhaps uses an average of 30 seconds per move.
In a 15+10 game, I would suggest an average of ~23 seconds per move.
@tpr said in #2:
> ... This is a 15+0 rapid game. ...
The https://lichess.org/C9LEmnpI
39 move game (~2 days ago), between Jclouds512 and Prakash_Karamala, was a 15+10 game.
@tpr said in #2:
> ... 13 Bxf7+ Kxf7 14 Qd2 is the fastest way to win ...
13 Bxf7+ would not have been a legal move. Probably, tpr was thinking of 17 Bxf7+.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
> ... My biggest advantage pre my opponent hanging the bishop was on move 17 where I could have played Bxf7 which is about 2 points better than the second best move. I honestly don't even quite understand how this wins just by looking at the move, but every computer line ends up with a winning advantage. ...
The thing about 17 Bxf7+ Kxf7 18 Qd2 is that it does not seem that Prakash_Karamala would have had anything acceptable to do about the danger to the d6-bishop. Perhaps the clue that might have helped Jclouds512 to spot this possibility is that 16...c6 eliminated the pawn's protection of the bishop.
@tpr said in #2:
> ... you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
As I read it, Jclouds512 used ~19 seconds to choose 17 Bb3, but it should be noted that the first 17 moves were played at an average rate that would have been appropriate if it had been expected that the game would last for 196 moves.
@tpr said in #2:
> 14 Rxd6 Qxd6 15 Nxe5 is the fastest way to win ...
14 Rxd6 would also have not been legal. 18 Rxd6 Qxd6 19 Nxe5 would, right off, have won a bishop and a pawn for the rook and created the follow-up danger of 20 Nxf7, simultaneously attacking Prakash_Karamala's queen and h8-rook.
@tpr said in #2:
> ... you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
Again, as near as I can tell, ~19 seconds were used to choose 18 Ba2, and it DID preserve some advantage.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
> ... On move 18 I can sack the exchange which wins a pawn and leads to a fork, this is also really hard to spot ...
I wonder if 18 Rxd6 was considered.
@tpr said in #2:
> 19 Rd2? throws away your advantage. 19 Qc4 was the way to hold on to your advantage, but you spent only 6 seconds.
As far as I can tell, ~64 seconds were used to choose 19 Rd2 which DID retain some advantage. Of course, 19 Qc4 would have been a lot better, and I wonder if Jclouds512 considered it.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
> ... On move 25 I can play Bxe6, the only move that gives white a win according to the computer, which is also seemingly a very advanced move. ...
Apparently, only ~10 seconds were used by Jclouds512 to choose 25 Bg3. At that point, Jclouds512 could have decided to use an average of 20 seconds per move and had enough time to last up to move 87.
I am not sure why Jclouds512 regards 25 Bxe6 as an advanced move. It DOES appear that 25 Bxe6 would have been the only option good enough for an immediate winning advantage, but it seems that 25 Rd7 would also have been an improvement on the choice that Jclouds512 made.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
> ... tough to spot tactic happens on move 29 where my best option is to play Nh4 just giving up the knight to weaken the king. ...
During the ~3 seconds that Jclouds512 spent choosing 28 Qb3, I wonder if consideration was given to 28 Qe2 (with the hope of eventually playing Qh5)?
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
> ... To be honest most of these tactics seem way out of reach, (although correct me if I am wrong maybe they seem simple to you) so what ways of converting do you think are the easiest to digest and implement in future games for someone of roughly my elo?
> I know generic advice is just to do more puzzles and increase tactical awareness but tbh a lot of these tactics feel like they have to be master level lol ...
I do not think that moves like 17 Bxf7+ and 18 Rxd6 are simple to find, but I also think that it would be a mistake to regard them as out of reach to anyone below master level. There were clues in the position to suggest their viability.
I know someone who once suggested playing through every single Morphy game. That would perhaps be overdoing it, but Jclouds512 might find it to be a mind-expanding experience to work through A First Book of Morphy.
@tpr said in #2:
> You play too fast. ...
It seems quite possible that rushing was a factor in the failure to play moves like 28 Qe2, 25 Bxe6, or 25 Rd7.
19 Rd2 (and 13 a3 instead of 13 Nd5) may not have been rush decisions, but they do look like they may have been the result of failures to consider aggressive options.
@tpr said in #2:
> ... Switch to 15+10 with increment and spend 40 seconds per move and finish the game on increment. ...
That seems to be a suggestion to average 40 seconds per move for the first 30 moves and subsequently try to survive on the 10 second increments.
"... everyone is different, so what works for one person may likely fail with another ..." - NM Dan Heisman (2002)
https://web.archive.org/web/20140627084053/http://www.chesscafe.com/text/heisman19.pdf
As 19 Rd2 indicates, 40 seconds is no guarantee of a quality move. I suspect that many players will often fail to reach an easily won position after 30 moves against an opponent who perhaps uses an average of 30 seconds per move.
In a 15+10 game, I would suggest an average of ~23 seconds per move.
for your elo it is enough to start pushing you opponent early and roll them with kingside attacks, development is up to you
this advice sucks compared to the others but is realistic for you to learn and implement, there is time and place for the others, later
for your elo it is enough to start pushing you opponent early and roll them with kingside attacks, development is up to you
this advice sucks compared to the others but is realistic for you to learn and implement, there is time and place for the others, later
@tpr said in #2:
You play too fast. This is a 15+0 rapid game. Most chess games are essentially decided by move 30. That means you should play at about 30 seconds per move. You played as if it were a 5+0 blitz game.
When you solve tactics puzzles, how many seconds do you use per puzzle?
Switch to 15+10 with increment and spend 40 seconds per move and finish the game on increment. Take time to think.
13 Bxf7+ Kxf7 14 Qd2 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
14 Rxd6 Qxd6 15 Nxe5 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
19 Rd2? throws away your advantage. 19 Qc4 was the way to hold on to your advantage, but you spent only 6 seconds.
Are the tactics you described here ones that you think you could have spotted in a rapid game? You are about 500 points higher rated than me, so if the answer is no then I might just not worry about missing these moves.
@tpr said in #2:
> You play too fast. This is a 15+0 rapid game. Most chess games are essentially decided by move 30. That means you should play at about 30 seconds per move. You played as if it were a 5+0 blitz game.
> When you solve tactics puzzles, how many seconds do you use per puzzle?
> Switch to 15+10 with increment and spend 40 seconds per move and finish the game on increment. Take time to think.
>
> 13 Bxf7+ Kxf7 14 Qd2 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
> 14 Rxd6 Qxd6 15 Nxe5 is the fastest way to win, but you spent only 9 seconds and that is not enough to find it.
> 19 Rd2? throws away your advantage. 19 Qc4 was the way to hold on to your advantage, but you spent only 6 seconds.
Are the tactics you described here ones that you think you could have spotted in a rapid game? You are about 500 points higher rated than me, so if the answer is no then I might just not worry about missing these moves.
"Are the tactics you described here ones that you think you could have spotted in a rapid game?"
- Maybe, maybe not. But I would have thought longer than you did. Did you consider those moves? What moves did you consider in those positions?
"I might just not worry about missing these moves"
- It is the other way around. You are rated as you are because you miss many tactics. You should not worry about missing these, but you should at least try to consider such moves in future games and think longer, i.e. make better use of your time.
"Are the tactics you described here ones that you think you could have spotted in a rapid game?"
* Maybe, maybe not. But I would have thought longer than you did. Did you consider those moves? What moves did you consider in those positions?
"I might just not worry about missing these moves"
* It is the other way around. You are rated as you are because you miss many tactics. You should not worry about missing these, but you should at least try to consider such moves in future games and think longer, i.e. make better use of your time.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
... My biggest advantage pre my opponent hanging the bishop was on move 17 where I could have played Bxf7 which is about 2 points better than the second best move. I honestly don't even quite understand how this wins just by looking at the move, but every computer line ends up with a winning advantage. ...
@Jclouds512 said (to tpr) in #5:
... Are the tactics you described here ones that you think you could have spotted in a rapid game?
@tpr said in #6:
... Maybe, maybe not. But I would have thought longer than you did. ...
I guess both tpr and I agree that more than ~19 seconds would have been appropriate for move 17. If Jclouds512 had used my recommendation, (~23 seconds per move for a 15+10 game) for the first 16 moves, Jclouds512's 15-minute reserve would have been down to 11 minutes and 32 seconds.
However, Jclouds512 had managed to get past move 16 with a notable advantage and 13 minutes and 51 seconds remaining in the reserve, meaning that it would have been consistent with my advice if Jclouds512 had spent 2 minutes and 42 seconds on move 17.
Would that have been a good idea? Probably not. One of the dangers of spending a lot of time on one move is that it can turn out that the time was wasted if a flaw is eventually discovered in an attacking idea.
@Jclouds512 said (to tpr) in #5:
You are about 500 points higher rated than me, so if the answer is no then I might just not worry about missing these moves.
@tpr said in #6:
... You should not worry about missing these, but you should at least try to consider such moves in future games and ...
With that goal in mind, it might be a good idea to take a close look at 17 Bxf7+ Kxf7 18 Qd2
https://lichess.org/ImfAV97i
httpscolon//lichess.org/ImfAV97i
and see if there are clues to why it works. As I previously mentioned, 16...c6 had made Prakash_Karamala's d6-bishop more vulnerable. It might also be noted that, with both the d6-bishop and the d7-knight on an open file and attacked by Jclouds512's queen and d1-rook, Prakash_Karamala would not have been able to move the d6-bishop without allowing the d7-knight to be captured.
Becoming aware of such clues might help one to spot similar opportunities in the future.
@Jclouds512 said in #1:
> ... My biggest advantage pre my opponent hanging the bishop was on move 17 where I could have played Bxf7 which is about 2 points better than the second best move. I honestly don't even quite understand how this wins just by looking at the move, but every computer line ends up with a winning advantage. ...
@Jclouds512 said (to tpr) in #5:
> ... Are the tactics you described here ones that you think you could have spotted in a rapid game?
@tpr said in #6:
> ... Maybe, maybe not. But I would have thought longer than you did. ...
I guess both tpr and I agree that more than ~19 seconds would have been appropriate for move 17. If Jclouds512 had used my recommendation, (~23 seconds per move for a 15+10 game) for the first 16 moves, Jclouds512's 15-minute reserve would have been down to 11 minutes and 32 seconds.
However, Jclouds512 had managed to get past move 16 with a notable advantage and 13 minutes and 51 seconds remaining in the reserve, meaning that it would have been consistent with my advice if Jclouds512 had spent 2 minutes and 42 seconds on move 17.
Would that have been a good idea? Probably not. One of the dangers of spending a lot of time on one move is that it can turn out that the time was wasted if a flaw is eventually discovered in an attacking idea.
@Jclouds512 said (to tpr) in #5:
> You are about 500 points higher rated than me, so if the answer is no then I might just not worry about missing these moves.
@tpr said in #6:
> ... You should not worry about missing these, but you should at least try to consider such moves in future games and ...
With that goal in mind, it might be a good idea to take a close look at 17 Bxf7+ Kxf7 18 Qd2
https://lichess.org/ImfAV97i
httpscolon//lichess.org/ImfAV97i
and see if there are clues to why it works. As I previously mentioned, 16...c6 had made Prakash_Karamala's d6-bishop more vulnerable. It might also be noted that, with both the d6-bishop and the d7-knight on an open file and attacked by Jclouds512's queen and d1-rook, Prakash_Karamala would not have been able to move the d6-bishop without allowing the d7-knight to be captured.
Becoming aware of such clues might help one to spot similar opportunities in the future.
"Jclouds512 had managed to get past move 16 with a notable advantage "
- Because his opponent has played even faster and made serious mistakes.
9...e5? played in 3 seconds.
13...Ne7? played in 20 seconds.
14...h6? played in 15 seconds
16...c6? played in 2 seconds
My recommendation is to play 15+10 at 40 seconds per move average.
"Jclouds512 had managed to get past move 16 with a notable advantage "
* Because his opponent has played even faster and made serious mistakes.
9...e5? played in 3 seconds.
13...Ne7? played in 20 seconds.
14...h6? played in 15 seconds
16...c6? played in 2 seconds
My recommendation is to play 15+10 at 40 seconds per move average.
In a 15+10 game, 40 seconds per move would completely exhaust the 15-minute reserve after 30 moves.
@kindaspongey said in #3:
... As 19 Rd2 indicates, 40 seconds is no guarantee of a quality move. I suspect that many players will often fail to reach an easily won position after 30 moves against an opponent who perhaps uses an average of 30 seconds per move. ...
Without an easy win, many could expect disaster playing 10 seconds per move against an opponent who is in a position to continue playing at 30 seconds per move for 15 more moves.
In a 15+10 game, 40 seconds per move would completely exhaust the 15-minute reserve after 30 moves.
@kindaspongey said in #3:
> ... As 19 Rd2 indicates, 40 seconds is no guarantee of a quality move. I suspect that many players will often fail to reach an easily won position after 30 moves against an opponent who perhaps uses an average of 30 seconds per move. ...
Without an easy win, many could expect disaster playing 10 seconds per move against an opponent who is in a position to continue playing at 30 seconds per move for 15 more moves.
"In a 15+10 game, 40 seconds per move would completely exhaust the 15-minute reserve after 30 moves."
- Exactly: 10 seconds per move should suffice to convert a winning position.
"40 seconds is no guarantee of a quality move"
- 40 seconds per move is average. For a critical position you may take 80 seconds. Of course taking 40 seconds per move does not guarantee a quality move, but 20 seconds per move guarantees mistakes.
"I suspect that many players will often fail to reach an easily won position after 30 moves against an opponent who perhaps uses an average of 30 seconds per move."
- When two equal players play, the one who uses more time is more likely to reach a won position.
"Without an easy win, many could expect disaster playing 10 seconds per move against an opponent who is in a position to continue playing at 30 seconds per move for 15 more moves."
- If the opponent managed to keep the game even at 30 seconds/move against 40 seconds/move, then he is stronger. 10 seconds per move should suffice. The position will be simplified by move 30: trades made, pawns locked. Moreover, the thoughts during moves 1-30 help to play correctly beyond move 30.
"In a 15+10 game, 40 seconds per move would completely exhaust the 15-minute reserve after 30 moves."
* Exactly: 10 seconds per move should suffice to convert a winning position.
"40 seconds is no guarantee of a quality move"
* 40 seconds per move is average. For a critical position you may take 80 seconds. Of course taking 40 seconds per move does not guarantee a quality move, but 20 seconds per move guarantees mistakes.
"I suspect that many players will often fail to reach an easily won position after 30 moves against an opponent who perhaps uses an average of 30 seconds per move."
* When two equal players play, the one who uses more time is more likely to reach a won position.
"Without an easy win, many could expect disaster playing 10 seconds per move against an opponent who is in a position to continue playing at 30 seconds per move for 15 more moves."
* If the opponent managed to keep the game even at 30 seconds/move against 40 seconds/move, then he is stronger. 10 seconds per move should suffice. The position will be simplified by move 30: trades made, pawns locked. Moreover, the thoughts during moves 1-30 help to play correctly beyond move 30.