Reporting Cheaters • page 1/2 • General Chess Discussion • lichess.org

I've reported a bunch of players with 0 inaccuracies, 0 mistakes, and 0 blunders, and got no responses; what proof is needed exactly to report someone for cheating?

cashcow8

#2

You will eventually get a notification "someone you reported was banned" if that happened to one of the players, but that's all you will be told.

In your report, you would have been asked to give the game or games where you thought they used assistance.

Not every game with 0 inaccuracies is a sign of cheating - often if a player blunders badly just out of the opening book you wlil find that happens. Even though their opponent isn't finding all the top engine moves they are good enough to not be marked as inaccurate.

In variants, and players have been banned for cheating at variants, but there are some common opening traps against which many players will know the forced win and you can't prove they used assistance on the game just because they executed them. So I have 0 inaccuracy games at anti-chess where my opponent blundered early on e.g. 1. e4. Not as white as the engine gives my common opening move 1 g4 as an inaccuracy so I have one to start off.

You will eventually get a notification "someone you reported was banned" if that happened to one of the players, but that's all you will be told. In your report, you would have been asked to give the game or games where you thought they used assistance. Not every game with 0 inaccuracies is a sign of cheating - often if a player blunders badly just out of the opening book you wlil find that happens. Even though their opponent isn't finding all the top engine moves they are good enough to not be marked as inaccurate. In variants, and players have been banned for cheating at variants, but there are some common opening traps against which many players will know the forced win and you can't prove they used assistance on the game just because they executed them. So I have 0 inaccuracy games at anti-chess where my opponent blundered early on e.g. 1. e4. Not as white as the engine gives my common opening move 1 g4 as an inaccuracy so I have one to start off.

DIDwePLAYaFAMOUSgame

#3

What I would do is pick one game you think you played really well in, copy the moves only (no names). Post the game with which side you were on and then others can look at the game and see what moves you could have made and if it was easy or not.

The accuracy numbers only really reflect the beginning of the game. If you are up 10 points and lose a rook, you are still up 5 points, so it won't say you blundered. I would have to look at those moves to give you an honest opinion.

What I would do is pick one game you think you played really well in, copy the moves only (no names). Post the game with which side you were on and then others can look at the game and see what moves you could have made and if it was easy or not. The accuracy numbers only really reflect the beginning of the game. If you are up 10 points and lose a rook, you are still up 5 points, so it won't say you blundered. I would have to look at those moves to give you an honest opinion.

HadesThirteen edited

#4

@cashcow8 I copy/paste the games in question, so yeah, Lichess knows which game. I report the games with 0 inaccuracies, 0 mistakes, and 0 blunders that have gone a good way because yes, I understand that if I blunder early and the game is over quickly it is indeed probable that my opponent had no time to make any inaccuracy etc. I've had my account since early February, and reported a first time shortly after that: never got a response. Thank you :)

@DIDwePLAYaFAMOUSgame I'm not very tech savvy, I kind of understand what you're suggesting; I might look into that. Thank you :)

And since I indeed report games that have lasted a fair amount of time, my accuracy is usually pretty good: or else the game wouldn't last long I'm thinking.

@cashcow8 I copy/paste the games in question, so yeah, Lichess knows which game. I report the games with 0 inaccuracies, 0 mistakes, and 0 blunders that have gone a good way because yes, I understand that if I blunder early and the game is over quickly it is indeed probable that my opponent had no time to make any inaccuracy etc. I've had my account since early February, and reported a first time shortly after that: never got a response. Thank you :) @DIDwePLAYaFAMOUSgame I'm not very tech savvy, I kind of understand what you're suggesting; I might look into that. Thank you :) And since I indeed report games that have lasted a fair amount of time, my accuracy is usually pretty good: or else the game wouldn't last long I'm thinking.

cashcow8

#5

I found one such game you played. You played the opening very badly and it's difficult to say your opponent used assistance to get up by a minor piece, after which I didn't think your opponent even played that well, just well enough.

HadesThirteen edited

#6

@cashcow8 Did my opponent have 0 inaccuracy, 0 mistake, and 0 blunder, and the game lasted a fair amount of time? You can private message me if you want, to tell me what game.

Also, maybe take my rank into consideration; I'm not sure I'm at a level where my opponents detect and pounce right away on early mistakes.

@cashcow8 Did my opponent have 0 inaccuracy, 0 mistake, and 0 blunder, and the game lasted a fair amount of time? You can private message me if you want, to tell me what game. Also, maybe take my rank into consideration; I'm not sure I'm at a level where my opponents detect and pounce right away on early mistakes.

cashcow8

#7

In that game, yes your opponent had zero inaccuracies which surprised me as I thought Be6 was a blunder, as it loses a piece if you push the pawn. But by then he's about +9 which drops to about +7 so the engine obviously didn't think it was costly enough.

Basically after playing an opening which got your queen out early and then in the way of development, (e4 e5 d4 exd4 Qxd4) and pushing c3 and f3 thus further hampering your development you exchanged the only knight you had developed with his in the middle of the board and he played Ne3 threatening a fork on c2 which you countered with Na3 which was no use as he could just take that knight with his bishop.

In that game, yes your opponent had zero inaccuracies which surprised me as I thought Be6 was a blunder, as it loses a piece if you push the pawn. But by then he's about +9 which drops to about +7 so the engine obviously didn't think it was costly enough. Basically after playing an opening which got your queen out early and then in the way of development, (e4 e5 d4 exd4 Qxd4) and pushing c3 and f3 thus further hampering your development you exchanged the only knight you had developed with his in the middle of the board and he played Ne3 threatening a fork on c2 which you countered with Na3 which was no use as he could just take that knight with his bishop.

petri999

#8

At your level you most likely make many mistakes. And as it happens : it is easier to opponents mistake than ones own.

0 blunder 0 mistake 0 inaccuracy has very poor correlation with cheating. Mostly it is about game being easy i.e many moves where is hardly makes any difference to outcome of the game which one you pick.

Anyway you most probably will not be reported back on result of investigation. At least I have not heard anyone getting such a message. Such a message would feel like privacy violation anyway.You may get message you have some ratings point due to loss to a cheater but as far as I can tell not always.

At your level you most likely make many mistakes. And as it happens : it is easier to opponents mistake than ones own. 0 blunder 0 mistake 0 inaccuracy has very poor correlation with cheating. Mostly it is about game being easy i.e many moves where is hardly makes any difference to outcome of the game which one you pick. Anyway you most probably will not be reported back on result of investigation. At least I have not heard anyone getting such a message. Such a message would feel like privacy violation anyway.You may get message you have some ratings point due to loss to a cheater but as far as I can tell not always.

HadesThirteen

#9

@cashcow8 Sorry, I'm not chess savvy enough to understand anything of what you're telling me: which proves my point that my rank must be erroneous. Anyway, I'll have to take your word for it...Thank you!

cashcow8 edited

#10

My own view on the game was that you handled the opening badly enough that your opponent didn't need to use an engine to gain significant advantage against it, even at his level. Once he had a significant advantage, I actually thought your opponent had better moves to finish the job, but the analysis engine didn't penalise him for the way he played as he maintained a strong upper-hand throughout.

When you reported the game, my guess is that those on the panel who check these things came up with a similar conclusion on the game as me, and therefore couldn't prove that your opponent had cheated.

In future you'd do better to improve your opening play by trying to develop minor pieces first and castling, as well as having decent pawn structures.

My own view on the game was that you handled the opening badly enough that your opponent didn't need to use an engine to gain significant advantage against it, even at his level. Once he had a significant advantage, I actually thought your opponent had better moves to finish the job, but the analysis engine didn't penalise him for the way he played as he maintained a strong upper-hand throughout. When you reported the game, my guess is that those on the panel who check these things came up with a similar conclusion on the game as me, and therefore couldn't prove that your opponent had cheated. In future you'd do better to improve your opening play by trying to develop minor pieces first and castling, as well as having decent pawn structures.