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Cheating methods

Are you letting the computer analyze the games, are you reporting them? No? Why not?

Are you letting the computer analyze the games, are you reporting them? No? Why not?

So they are all cheating, and yet miraculously keep their low rating.

A study has shown that people are more likely to suspect others of cheating when they make bad moves themselves.

Lower rated players tend to make blunders often, so they suspect their opponents to cheat. Also, they are very inexperienced, and many moves made by their opponent feel like magic - although they might be very obvious to other players (which might other kind of moves).

As for the perfect openings - I think this is a myth. But there is probably a certain rating range at beginners level, where almost everyone plays the same openings, so they indeed can play many moves on auto pilot against similar players. Often without understanding the moves at all. If you go a little higher, then they start to explore different openings, giving much more variation, and people will be out of opening much earlier.

You can see the opening effect when observing kids tournaments. Every game goes 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc5 Bc5 etc.

So they are all cheating, and yet miraculously keep their low rating. A study has shown that people are more likely to suspect others of cheating when they make bad moves themselves. Lower rated players tend to make blunders often, so they suspect their opponents to cheat. Also, they are very inexperienced, and many moves made by their opponent feel like magic - although they might be very obvious to other players (which might other kind of moves). As for the perfect openings - I think this is a myth. But there is probably a certain rating range at beginners level, where almost everyone plays the same openings, so they indeed can play many moves on auto pilot against similar players. Often without understanding the moves at all. If you go a little higher, then they start to explore different openings, giving *much* more variation, and people will be out of opening much earlier. You can see the opening effect when observing kids tournaments. Every game goes 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc5 Bc5 etc.

I have not played in that rating bracket for ages, so can't comment specifically on that, but I have had my own versions of dropping rating points and feeling like lower-rated (than me) players are all of a sudden putting up extreme resistance. While cheating happens, I don't think that is the issue. The big issue is going on tilt. I have not had a 100 game stretch, but I have been guilty of 30-40 game tilts for sure. The thing is, someone 300 points or so lower rated can definitely beat you if you start making blunders. The brilliant moves you mention are likely not that brilliant, but I have had that feeling too myself occasionally. I mostly think that sometimes lower-rated players might make some super-aggressive but reckless moves that if gone unpunished can become a big issue, but when you are on a tilt you are not thinking clearly enough to take advantage and punish those moves.

I have not played in that rating bracket for ages, so can't comment specifically on that, but I have had my own versions of dropping rating points and feeling like lower-rated (than me) players are all of a sudden putting up extreme resistance. While cheating happens, I don't think that is the issue. The big issue is going on tilt. I have not had a 100 game stretch, but I have been guilty of 30-40 game tilts for sure. The thing is, someone 300 points or so lower rated can definitely beat you if you start making blunders. The brilliant moves you mention are likely not that brilliant, but I have had that feeling too myself occasionally. I mostly think that sometimes lower-rated players might make some super-aggressive but reckless moves that if gone unpunished can become a big issue, but when you are on a tilt you are not thinking clearly enough to take advantage and punish those moves.

@SvenLarsson

In my experience, most of the cheaters are lower rated players. Their reliance on engine analysis turns largely upon psychological factors. If lower rated players find themselves having been thoroughly outplayed in the opening by other players of a similar rating (dropping a piece, or missing a tactic) they tend to assume the other player is cheating, so they start cheating -- this is why you often experience clueless piece droppers transform into positional geniuses capable of masterfully fortifying their pieces against all attacks, while relentlessly finding a way to punish your every minor inaccuracy.

Yes, low rated players cheat ... constantly. But they do not cheat for the purpose of rising up the ratings ladder but to maintain their standing in the rating range they believe actually reflects their ability. They will cheat most often against similar or lower rated players that start to massively outplay them, but are comfortable slowly losing a close, competitive game against someone with a similar rating that is playing how they believe such a player should be playing.

There are no methods to statistically detect this type of cheating, yet it is very common.

You are not crazy. It is happening.

@SvenLarsson In my experience, most of the cheaters are lower rated players. Their reliance on engine analysis turns largely upon psychological factors. If lower rated players find themselves having been thoroughly outplayed in the opening by other players of a similar rating (dropping a piece, or missing a tactic) they tend to assume the other player is cheating, so they start cheating -- this is why you often experience clueless piece droppers transform into positional geniuses capable of masterfully fortifying their pieces against all attacks, while relentlessly finding a way to punish your every minor inaccuracy. Yes, low rated players cheat ... constantly. But they do not cheat for the purpose of rising up the ratings ladder but to maintain their standing in the rating range they believe actually reflects their ability. They will cheat most often against similar or lower rated players that start to massively outplay them, but are comfortable slowly losing a close, competitive game against someone with a similar rating that is playing how they believe such a player *should* be playing. There are no methods to statistically detect this type of cheating, yet it is very common. You are not crazy. It *is* happening.

There is nice quote that up to certain level, players don't beat each other, they rather beat themselves. It means that at lower levels, games are not decided by some brilliant ideas but mostly by blunders which come pretty randomly. Once in a while you are a bit unlucky and your opponent doesn't make any big blunder - or rather none that you would see - but that doesn't mean they played brilliant chess. After all, the same sometimes happens to you.

There are also psychological aspects. Apart from the tilt issues when losses and bad play tend to pile up, it can be actually harder to play against lower rated opponents. Recently I had a period where I had objectively better results against players in 1800-2000 range than 1600-1800. But analysis of the games shows that those lower rated opponents didn't really play better chess; rather I was playing worse, knowing that I should be playing for a win and sometimes lacking patience and pushing and risking too much. On the other hand, playing someone 100-200 points higher rated, I mostly feel relaxed, just do my best and see how it goes; after all it's up to them to come with some winning idea. And I'm pretty sure some of them suffered from exactly the same problem as I did when playing for a win.

There is nice quote that up to certain level, players don't beat each other, they rather beat themselves. It means that at lower levels, games are not decided by some brilliant ideas but mostly by blunders which come pretty randomly. Once in a while you are a bit unlucky and your opponent doesn't make any big blunder - or rather none that you would see - but that doesn't mean they played brilliant chess. After all, the same sometimes happens to you. There are also psychological aspects. Apart from the tilt issues when losses and bad play tend to pile up, it can be actually harder to play against lower rated opponents. Recently I had a period where I had objectively better results against players in 1800-2000 range than 1600-1800. But analysis of the games shows that those lower rated opponents didn't really play better chess; rather I was playing worse, knowing that I should be playing for a win and sometimes lacking patience and pushing and risking too much. On the other hand, playing someone 100-200 points higher rated, I mostly feel relaxed, just do my best and see how it goes; after all it's up to them to come with some winning idea. And I'm pretty sure some of them suffered from exactly the same problem as I did when playing for a win.

@mkubecek said in #16:

There is nice quote that up to certain level, players don't beat each other, they rather beat themselves. It means that at lower levels, games are not decided by some brilliant ideas but mostly by blunders which come pretty randomly. Once in a while you are a bit unlucky and your opponent doesn't make any big blunder - or rather none that you would see - but that doesn't mean they played brilliant chess. After all, the same sometimes happens to you.

There are also psychological aspects. Apart from the tilt issues when losses and bad play tend to pile up, it can be actually harder to play against lower rated opponents. Recently I had a period where I had objectively better results against players in 1800-2000 range than 1600-1800. But analysis of the games shows that those lower rated opponents didn't really play better chess; rather I was playing worse, knowing that I should be playing for a win and sometimes lacking patience and pushing and risking too much. On the other hand, playing someone 100-200 points higher rated, I mostly feel relaxed, just do my best and see how it goes; after all it's up to them to come with some winning idea. And I'm pretty sure some of them suffered from exactly the same problem as I did when playing for a win.

Yes, for some the glass is always half full, especially when they're wearing blinds

There are also chessassist and chess master, and chessvision extensions, where players set an elo close to their own level and play only certain recommended moves, when they need just a little help.

Certainly, using those programs is super relaxing, especially when playing 300-400 above one's real level.

@mkubecek said in #16: > There is nice quote that up to certain level, players don't beat each other, they rather beat themselves. It means that at lower levels, games are not decided by some brilliant ideas but mostly by blunders which come pretty randomly. Once in a while you are a bit unlucky and your opponent doesn't make any big blunder - or rather none that you would see - but that doesn't mean they played brilliant chess. After all, the same sometimes happens to you. > > There are also psychological aspects. Apart from the tilt issues when losses and bad play tend to pile up, it can be actually harder to play against lower rated opponents. Recently I had a period where I had objectively better results against players in 1800-2000 range than 1600-1800. But analysis of the games shows that those lower rated opponents didn't really play better chess; rather I was playing worse, knowing that I should be playing for a win and sometimes lacking patience and pushing and risking too much. On the other hand, playing someone 100-200 points higher rated, I mostly feel relaxed, just do my best and see how it goes; after all it's up to them to come with some winning idea. And I'm pretty sure some of them suffered from exactly the same problem as I did when playing for a win. Yes, for some the glass is always half full, especially when they're wearing blinds There are also chessassist and chess master, and chessvision extensions, where players set an elo close to their own level and play only certain recommended moves, when they need just a little help. Certainly, using those programs is super relaxing, especially when playing 300-400 above one's real level.

If they cheat you cheat back on them.
That fair :)

If they cheat you cheat back on them. That fair :)

Yes, for some the glass is always half full, especially when they're wearing blinds
Apparently you chose what to believe as it makes you feel better and there is no way to change your mind. But then speaking about "wearing blinds" is kind of ridiculous.

> Yes, for some the glass is always half full, especially when they're wearing blinds Apparently you chose what to believe as it makes you feel better and there is no way to change your mind. But then speaking about "wearing blinds" is kind of ridiculous.

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