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Why am I so freacking bad at blindfold chess?

#1

I mean, you all can see my games on here, and they are, well... Not really good. Yes, I may not be a world champion or anything like that, but after all I'm still a 1850 player OTB, on my main account I have a blitz rating of 2100-2200, and I think that a typical blindfold rating for a player of my strenght would be at the very least 1500. I know people (regular players, not masters) who only play slightly (maybe 100 points?) below their level, and they don't get to see the board, nor the notation. Moreover, I generally have no problems calculating really long variations (I'm talking about classical OTB), and in fact the area of the game where I'm strongest is tactics, so in theory I should be good at visualizing the board, but in practice I always find myself aimlessly nodding and pretending to understand everything when one of my friend tries to "show" me all the lines of MY game they calculated while passing by on their way to the restroom. To put it in a few words, yeah, I feel kinda stupid compared to them XD

I have never had such a low rating, and even when I first joined lichess 3 years ago, when I had just learned how the pieces move, my lowest rating was still 1400, so my question is, what's wrong with me?

I mean, you all can see my games on here, and they are, well... Not really good. Yes, I may not be a world champion or anything like that, but after all I'm still a 1850 player OTB, on my main account I have a blitz rating of 2100-2200, and I think that a typical blindfold rating for a player of my strenght would be at the very least 1500. I know people (regular players, not masters) who only play slightly (maybe 100 points?) below their level, and they don't get to see the board, nor the notation. Moreover, I generally have no problems calculating really long variations (I'm talking about classical OTB), and in fact the area of the game where I'm strongest is tactics, so in theory I should be good at visualizing the board, but in practice I always find myself aimlessly nodding and pretending to understand everything when one of my friend tries to "show" me all the lines of MY game they calculated while passing by on their way to the restroom. To put it in a few words, yeah, I feel kinda stupid compared to them XD I have never had such a low rating, and even when I first joined lichess 3 years ago, when I had just learned how the pieces move, my lowest rating was still 1400, so my question is, what's wrong with me?
#2

Try to read chess books. It will improve your chess level by as well help to develop the blindfold aspect of chess. (If you are about 2200 blitz on your real account, you should try harder chess books)

Try to read chess books. It will improve your chess level by as well help to develop the blindfold aspect of chess. (If you are about 2200 blitz on your real account, you should try harder chess books)
#3

@Blindfool2003

I've been on this case for a while now, and what I've found is that of the many different skill-sets that create a chess player, one of them is the capacity to visualize a chess board.

It's a little bit of an impossible discussion between GMs and us lower-rated players, because we have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to be able to study games in our mind's eye; and they have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to not be able to study games in their mind's eye.

So if you are trying to calculate a variation, and you find that the pieces 'don't stand still' and 'teleport' to random squares, and you have to continually 'reset the variation' and try again and again, then it's the case that you can't possibly play a game of chess from start to finish in your mind, much less study a position in your mind without a board present.

Yes, it's completely possible to have so thoroughly over-compensated in all of the other areas of skill-sets, to where you could have a 2000 rating with a blindfold score of 900, and where someone else with a rating of 1800 could have a blindfold rating of 1350.

It's completely possible in the exact same way that a 1900 rated player could look at a 1700 rated player and say, "I can teach you to beat me," and have that 1700 rated player fly past the 2100 mark within a year.

It's a matter of all of the different various 'tools' that are needed in chess.

Board visualization is a CRUCIAL element; I wish I had much better vision; but at the end of the day, there are many other ingredients that go into a good chess move that have little to do with the capacity to play entire games in your mind without a board.

If someone knows of a logical and surefire way to increase board vision (the skill needed to play blindfold), then that would be greatly appreciated information.

With that said, I mostly want to hear from someone that was 1700 for 10 years, thought of a method to improve visualization, employed the method, and now can play blindfolded and has vision like they never had before.

I'm not interested in the advice of someone who started chess at age 4 and has memory-mapped every piece and square.
Their advice would be useless as they are incompatible and illiterate regarding the problem that most of the rest of us have regarding an incapacity to visualize.

Apologies to OP for the partial redirect, but that would be my question to the community:

Does anyone, who has played chess at a lower-level for a very long time, have a method that they engaged in order to produce a visualization skill-set that was leaps and bounds better than what they were capable of before; to where they are now several hundred points ahead, and can now finally remember and replay their last game or any significant game?

I've periodically studied Botvinnik-Portisch so many times going all the way back to late 90s, early 00s, and I STILL don't know for certain if that rook infiltrates on b7 or c7, much less anything else about the position/game:

https://lichess.org/YDIIrRT1

@Blindfool2003 I've been on this case for a while now, and what I've found is that of the many different skill-sets that create a chess player, one of them is the capacity to visualize a chess board. It's a little bit of an impossible discussion between GMs and us lower-rated players, because we have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to be able to study games in our mind's eye; and they have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to not be able to study games in their mind's eye. So if you are trying to calculate a variation, and you find that the pieces 'don't stand still' and 'teleport' to random squares, and you have to continually 'reset the variation' and try again and again, then it's the case that you can't possibly play a game of chess from start to finish in your mind, much less study a position in your mind without a board present. Yes, it's completely possible to have so thoroughly over-compensated in all of the other areas of skill-sets, to where you could have a 2000 rating with a blindfold score of 900, and where someone else with a rating of 1800 could have a blindfold rating of 1350. It's completely possible in the exact same way that a 1900 rated player could look at a 1700 rated player and say, "I can teach you to beat me," and have that 1700 rated player fly past the 2100 mark within a year. It's a matter of all of the different various 'tools' that are needed in chess. Board visualization is a CRUCIAL element; I wish I had much better vision; but at the end of the day, there are many other ingredients that go into a good chess move that have little to do with the capacity to play entire games in your mind without a board. If someone knows of a logical and surefire way to increase board vision (the skill needed to play blindfold), then that would be greatly appreciated information. With that said, I mostly want to hear from someone that was 1700 for 10 years, thought of a method to improve visualization, employed the method, and now can play blindfolded and has vision like they never had before. I'm not interested in the advice of someone who started chess at age 4 and has memory-mapped every piece and square. Their advice would be useless as they are incompatible and illiterate regarding the problem that most of the rest of us have regarding an incapacity to visualize. Apologies to OP for the partial redirect, but that would be my question to the community: Does anyone, who has played chess at a lower-level for a very long time, have a method that they engaged in order to produce a visualization skill-set that was leaps and bounds better than what they were capable of before; to where they are now several hundred points ahead, and can now finally remember and replay their last game or any significant game? I've periodically studied Botvinnik-Portisch so many times going all the way back to late 90s, early 00s, and I STILL don't know for certain if that rook infiltrates on b7 or c7, much less anything else about the position/game: https://lichess.org/YDIIrRT1
#5

@Onyx_Chess

Many thanks for your detailed answer,
I'll copy and paste the parts I want to respond to, I hope this turns out to be a readable text since I'm on mobile and I don't know any other way to write it.

"It's a little bit of an impossible discussion between GMs and us lower-rated players, because we have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to be able to study games in our mind's eye; and they have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to not be able to study games in their mind's eye."

Maybe that's true for these few child prodigies that now are super GMs, but I don't think that every strong player was just "born that way". Titled players had to put a awful lot of effort into it to become what they are now, the only difference is that maybe for them the whole process might have felt a little more natural, but even if you are talented it's not like you wake up one morning and suddenly are able to play blindfold chess, so I think that most of them do have memories of what it was like when they were learning. You seem to think of it in terms of "leaps", but, IMHO, it's more of a gradual process.

"So if you are trying to calculate a variation, and you find that the pieces 'don't stand still' and 'teleport' to random squares, and you have to continually 'reset the variation' and try again and again [...]"

Yes, that's exactly my problem when it comes to online blind chess. Also, pawns and pieces (typically the opponent's) often just "disappear", and I have to think about my position to realize that something is missing.
I say "online" because in the rare occasions I try to play with real people I don't face this kind of problem. For example I use to play with my dad (1600 on lichess) so that he can see the board and I can't, and we have a sort of balanced game. I'd say I win about 50% of the times. I think the reasons for this are:
1-they aren't blitz games, and I have as much time as I want to think.
2-I have to say the moves out loud. As silly as it may sound, it actually helps memorization in my experience
3-I am motivated to win and pay more attention to the game

From 2200 to 1600 is still a massive rating drop, but at least it's something.

Honestly, I don't think that I just "can't visualize", what's strange about it is that this lack of visualization only applies to chess! For instance, when I was in middle school I could (still can btw) solve high school or college level geometry problems in my head with absolutely no trouble whatsoever.

After all maybe it's more of a lack of focus, but still, everyone around me seems to be able to do it completely effortlessly.

@Onyx_Chess Many thanks for your detailed answer, I'll copy and paste the parts I want to respond to, I hope this turns out to be a readable text since I'm on mobile and I don't know any other way to write it. "It's a little bit of an impossible discussion between GMs and us lower-rated players, because we have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to be able to study games in our mind's eye; and they have absolutely no point of reference as to what it's like to not be able to study games in their mind's eye." Maybe that's true for these few child prodigies that now are super GMs, but I don't think that every strong player was just "born that way". Titled players had to put a awful lot of effort into it to become what they are now, the only difference is that maybe for them the whole process might have felt a little more natural, but even if you are talented it's not like you wake up one morning and suddenly are able to play blindfold chess, so I think that most of them do have memories of what it was like when they were learning. You seem to think of it in terms of "leaps", but, IMHO, it's more of a gradual process. "So if you are trying to calculate a variation, and you find that the pieces 'don't stand still' and 'teleport' to random squares, and you have to continually 'reset the variation' and try again and again [...]" Yes, that's exactly my problem when it comes to online blind chess. Also, pawns and pieces (typically the opponent's) often just "disappear", and I have to think about my position to realize that something is missing. I say "online" because in the rare occasions I try to play with real people I don't face this kind of problem. For example I use to play with my dad (1600 on lichess) so that he can see the board and I can't, and we have a sort of balanced game. I'd say I win about 50% of the times. I think the reasons for this are: 1-they aren't blitz games, and I have as much time as I want to think. 2-I have to say the moves out loud. As silly as it may sound, it actually helps memorization in my experience 3-I am motivated to win and pay more attention to the game From 2200 to 1600 is still a massive rating drop, but at least it's something. Honestly, I don't think that I just "can't visualize", what's strange about it is that this lack of visualization only applies to chess! For instance, when I was in middle school I could (still can btw) solve high school or college level geometry problems in my head with absolutely no trouble whatsoever. After all maybe it's more of a lack of focus, but still, everyone around me seems to be able to do it completely effortlessly.
#6

@Letgoofmychessego

The first thing we'll need is a "can-do" attitude.

So let's start with the assumption that it is possible.

So far, what I've deduced, is that GMs have never spent 2000 hours, per year, working hard to earn the skill of visualization.

So far, it's understood that there is an entire method of perception that needs to be tore down completely, and built back up correctly. If it is possible, I don't see any way around this. Obviously, something is utterly lacking.

Interestingly enough, I had an eyelash in my last game, and when I took my glasses off, I realized that not being able to easily see the board could help bolster the skill needed to memorize where the pieces are, as it would be easier than squinting.

Could there be an exercise where we make 'memorizing'/'knowing' to be easier than looking?
If so, might that help?

Could probably manipulate 'the path of least resistance' to do the work for us, or something else on those same lines of logic, or maybe something in tandem with, or related to those lines of logic?

@Letgoofmychessego The first thing we'll need is a "can-do" attitude. So let's start with the assumption that it is possible. So far, what I've deduced, is that GMs have never spent 2000 hours, per year, working hard to earn the skill of visualization. So far, it's understood that there is an entire method of perception that needs to be tore down completely, and built back up correctly. If it is possible, I don't see any way around this. Obviously, something is utterly lacking. Interestingly enough, I had an eyelash in my last game, and when I took my glasses off, I realized that not being able to easily see the board could help bolster the skill needed to memorize where the pieces are, as it would be easier than squinting. Could there be an exercise where we make 'memorizing'/'knowing' to be easier than looking? If so, might that help? Could probably manipulate 'the path of least resistance' to do the work for us, or something else on those same lines of logic, or maybe something in tandem with, or related to those lines of logic?
#7

Is there any kind of clear definition which kind of skills are needed to play blindfold chess successfully ?

  1. Do I simply have to improve my memory in such a way that I know everytime where all pieces are ?

  2. Or is it needed to have a clear vision of a chessboard inside of my head ?

I made a little exercise. I took a random object in my apartment and looked at it for about 5 minutes from different angles.
Then I closed my eyes and tried to visualize this object in my mind. I never managed to get a clear vision of this object. Everything was blurred and the object simply disappeared. I guess that I am not a person who will ever be able to play blindfold chess.

I know about a book written by Frances A. Yates in 1966. "The Art of Memory"
This book describes different kind of techniques which were used during the last few thousand years to improve the human memory.
This book was mentioned as a reference in a book about the fictional serial killer "Hannibal Lecter".
Hannibal Lecter had the ability in this book to live in some kind of memory palace inside of his head, where he could walk through all rooms and could look on his fictional collection of art pieces as if they were real.

Edit: Sorry for mentioning a serial killer in this forum. But ....
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dngOGHXVdo

Is there any kind of clear definition which kind of skills are needed to play blindfold chess successfully ? 1. Do I simply have to improve my memory in such a way that I know everytime where all pieces are ? 2. Or is it needed to have a clear vision of a chessboard inside of my head ? I made a little exercise. I took a random object in my apartment and looked at it for about 5 minutes from different angles. Then I closed my eyes and tried to visualize this object in my mind. I never managed to get a clear vision of this object. Everything was blurred and the object simply disappeared. I guess that I am not a person who will ever be able to play blindfold chess. I know about a book written by Frances A. Yates in 1966. "The Art of Memory" This book describes different kind of techniques which were used during the last few thousand years to improve the human memory. This book was mentioned as a reference in a book about the fictional serial killer "Hannibal Lecter". Hannibal Lecter had the ability in this book to live in some kind of memory palace inside of his head, where he could walk through all rooms and could look on his fictional collection of art pieces as if they were real. Edit: Sorry for mentioning a serial killer in this forum. But .... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dngOGHXVdo
#8

My question to the community would be:

Is there anyone who has tried playing blindfold, who was atrocious to begin with, but as they stuck with it and dedicated themselves to making their mind see the pieces more clearly, that they found vast improvements occur?

Logically speaking, it seems that simply playing strictly blindfold might be the best process for installing better vision...

My question to the community would be: Is there anyone who has tried playing blindfold, who was atrocious to begin with, but as they stuck with it and dedicated themselves to making their mind see the pieces more clearly, that they found vast improvements occur? Logically speaking, it seems that simply playing strictly blindfold might be the best process for installing better vision...
#10

#4 Its true...Some people can't visualize very well or at all. The name of the malady is Aphantasia. I have it, and I can only hold a mental image for a brief moment. This makes blindfold chess impossible for me. What's weird is that mental images in my dreams are quite vivid.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/when-the-minds-eye-is-blind1/ - I recall reading some good info on blindfold play by GM Rueben Fine. He was a renowned blindfold player :]

#4 Its true...Some people can't visualize very well or at all. The name of the malady is Aphantasia. I have it, and I can only hold a mental image for a brief moment. This makes blindfold chess impossible for me. What's weird is that mental images in my dreams are quite vivid. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/when-the-minds-eye-is-blind1/ - I recall reading some good info on blindfold play by GM Rueben Fine. He was a renowned blindfold player :]

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