Takeback ettiquette

@Toscani said in #25:
> If there is a take-back, the piece touched must still be played. So there needs a feature to force that piece to be played. If the opponents piece has been captured, then the move is complete and the piece cannot be taken back.
> If the feature does not exist, it should.
>

This is an interesting suggestion that I don't remember seeing before.

People complain about "mouse slips" ruining games, and I'm sure we've all had a few. I had one a few games ago where I was dragging a bishop to capture a knight but accidentally dropped it on the wrong square, losing it for nothing. This was in a tournament game so a takeback wasn't even an option. I wouldn't have requested one anyway as I'm a firm believer that these things even out over time. But the idea to allow a takeback but require the moved piece to be moved...I kind of like that.

So there could be 2 types of takeback allowed by the system - one would be the current one (take back move, play anything), the other would be take back move but must move the same piece. This could be a something each user could set (along with the option for no takebacks at all).

I permit takebacks in openings but not later.

@bwulf2025 said in #1:
> I've been in a few games recently when my opponent has asked for a takeback because they did something stupid and I've given them one, but then I ask for a takeback in return when I've done something stupid, and they decline. It's making me think twice on accepting takebacks at all. Should I ask for their confirmation in the chat that they will give me a takeback?
I only do take backs if they make an obvious mouse slip.

There is no ettiquette in terms of take backs. it is voluntary. There is no law on lichess.org to accept a take back. You can choose to accept or not. Bear in mind that your opponent has every right in the world to decline/accept your take back even if doing so would result in you losing.

In chess, except internet issues, there is no one to blame but the player him/her/whatever gender pronoun self.

@chorismate said in #21:
> No takebacks in rated games.
>
> Mouse slips are to online chess as touch-move is to over-the-board chess.

The exact same people who invented the touch-move rule for OTB chess also invented the takeback rule for online chess, for the exact same reason, and to serve the exact same purpose.

You're correct.
They are fundamentally the same thing, but not in the way that you are positing.

There is a very good reason that I've never seen a player intend to trade queens and then accidentally drop it a square short in an OTB tournament. The reason that this doesn't happen is because it would devalue chess and make it irritating to play.

People would quickly give up chess if random accidents routinely destroyed perfectly good chess games.
We'd want to be rid of these kinds of accidents so that we could move away from non-chess, and towards chess, in order to improve the game.

Just as we saw a problem occurring in OTB play where people touching pieces and putting them back became an issue and we made a rule to prevent the drawback of this activity...so it is with the unfortunate drawbacks of playing chess online where other instances can destroy the experience.

Both rules were made by the exact same people, for the exact same reason, and to serve the exact same ends.

We used to only move up one square, and decided that pawns should move up 2 instead.
We tried that for a bit, realized that there were some challenges with it, and so we invented an en passant rule.
We realized that being allowed an infinite amount of time produced drawbacks, and so we invented the clock.

All of these things, and many more, were invented by the exact same people, for the exact same reason, and in order to serve the exact same ends.

When all the chips are down, "non-moves should be allowed/encouraged/normalized/chosen/preferred" is not a hill that any chess player would die on. Nobody thinks that chess works better that way.

Imagine if you were in an afterlife, looking for a game of chess, and in every game of chess you played your opponent accidentally made a non-move that you were obligated to take advantage of.

Imagine that you couldn't help but "win" every single game of chess that you played in your afterlife due to this bizarre happenstance.

How long would you enjoy the game for?
Would you wake up every morning rushing to go "win" some more games of chess?
Or would your chess experience be destroyed by non-moves?
Would you miss playing chess and invent a takeback rule so that you could finally enjoy a perfectly good game of chess again?

Across the last several months, my opponents and I have been making excellent use of the takeback feature.

Of about 20 instances, I believe that 100% of my opponents had the feature enabled and it was used to good success.

Note: This case was made with Classical/Rapid time controls in mind.
Note: This case was made with obvious non-moves in mind.

it's not serious to propose for take back, even in casual games.
ofc you can missclick, especially in lichess app, but cmon, it happen so rare, so ... if you, trying to make castling occasionally moved your king from e1 to f1, let your opponent think it's your tricky plan, not mistake :D

@Lestrae said in #31:
> it's not serious to propose for take back, even in casual games.
> ofc you can missclick, especially in lichess app, but cmon, it happen so rare, so ... if you, trying to make castling occasionally moved your king from e1 to f1, let your opponent think it's your tricky plan, not mistake :D
Yes

No takebacks. Losing is part of the game too.

Only time I've asked for a takeback is in 1 blitz game at our club where I was playing a sequence of games (B,W,B,W...) with each being a Marshall gambit. Opponent & I were just doing it to get experience in the Marshall from both sides. In 1 game I dropped a piece really early so the game was worthless for our purpose and I asked if I could take it back and continue the game. He agreed.

That's the only time.

A few times against beginners in skittles games I've suggested that they shouldn't make a move they were about to make due to dropping a queen for example. Maybe I shouldn't do that but if a beginner is playing so far a coherent game I'd want to let them keep it going.

Bill

I let my daughter have takebacks all the time, I'll even suggest it to her before she asks.