Intersting thing is Hans Niemann Report (Cheaters are rare 2.0) • page 1/7 • General Chess Discussion • lichess.org

In the report everyone is discussing now, chess.com has mentioned that they "estimate that fewer than 0.14% of
players on Chess.com ever cheat." A while ago I created a thread

https://lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/cheaters-are-rare

in which I argued that widespread opinion that online chess is dominated by cheaters is a gross exaggeration. Even though many agreed with the post, there was a sizable push back in the thread.

Now we have an actual number from the most popular chess platform on the internet. Only 14 people in 10,000 ever cheat on their site. Yes, it is an estimate, and on other sites this number may be different, but we know the order of magnitude now. It is less than 1%.

So I reiterate with more confidence: cheater are rare.

Edit: There is a typo in the title, it should read: Intersting thing iN Hans Niemann Report (Cheaters are rare 2.0)

In the report everyone is discussing now, chess.com has mentioned that they "estimate that fewer than 0.14% of players on Chess.com ever cheat." A while ago I created a thread https://lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/cheaters-are-rare in which I argued that widespread opinion that online chess is dominated by cheaters is a gross exaggeration. Even though many agreed with the post, there was a sizable push back in the thread. Now we have an actual number from the most popular chess platform on the internet. Only 14 people in 10,000 ever cheat on their site. Yes, it is an estimate, and on other sites this number may be different, but we know the order of magnitude now. It is less than 1%. So I reiterate with more confidence: cheater are rare. Edit: There is a typo in the title, it should read: Intersting thing iN Hans Niemann Report (Cheaters are rare 2.0)

Always agree!

They may not be common, but ANY cheater is a problem that must be dealt with. Chess.com has MILLIONS of members, so 14 in 10,000 is still a LOT of people. And up until this fiasco, it seems like chess.com was only giving them slaps on the wrist. Hopefully that will change now. But, the reality is that there are forms of online cheating that are impossible to catch. If someone has an engine open on their phone while playing on their computer, or an opening book, there's no way you'll ever catch that, and it's an unfortunate reality.

GreviousOne

#4

They were telling a different story a couple years ago. https://lifestyle.livemint.com/news/big-story/2020-the-year-of-a-pandemic-of-cheating-in-online-chess-111608726864958.html

ohcomeon_1

#5

The point of this (and previous) thread is that cheaters are a clear minority. The absolute majority of chess players play fairly.

ShiningDrongo

#6

@ohcomeon_1

but we know the order of magnitude now. It is less than 1%.

Do we? How does 0.14% explain 4 caught online cheaters among the top 100 GMs? What I'd like to see is a strength distribution graph of selective cheaters. The average percentage doesn't tell me much.

@ohcomeon_1 > but we know the order of magnitude now. It is less than 1%. Do we? How does 0.14% explain 4 caught online cheaters among the top 100 GMs? What I'd like to see is a strength distribution graph of selective cheaters. The average percentage doesn't tell me much.

tryan82

#7

@ohcomeon_1 said in #5:

The point of this (and previous) thread is that cheaters are a clear minority. The absolute majority of chess players play fairly.

I don't care if they're a minority. If there is one, it's a problem.

@ohcomeon_1 said in #5: > The point of this (and previous) thread is that cheaters are a clear minority. The absolute majority of chess players play fairly. I don't care if they're a minority. If there is one, it's a problem.

ohcomeon_1

#8

@tryan82 said in #7:

I don't care if they're a minority. If there is one, it's a problem.

Did I say anywhere that cheating should be tolerated?

I was simply responding to a somewhat widespread opinion that online chess is infested with cheaters to such an extent that one encounters cheaters all the time, which is simply not true.

@tryan82 said in #7: > I don't care if they're a minority. If there is one, it's a problem. Did I say anywhere that cheating should be tolerated? I was simply responding to a somewhat widespread opinion that online chess is infested with cheaters to such an extent that one encounters cheaters all the time, which is simply not true.

tryan82

#9

@ohcomeon_1 said in #8:

Did I say anywhere that cheating should be tolerated?

No, but it sounds like you are saying that if the cheaters aren't a numerical MAJORITY, it isn't a significant problem. I disagree.

@ohcomeon_1 said in #8: > Did I say anywhere that cheating should be tolerated? No, but it sounds like you are saying that if the cheaters aren't a numerical MAJORITY, it isn't a significant problem. I disagree.

ohcomeon_1 edited

#10

@ShiningDrongo said in #6:

Do we? How does 0.14% explain 4 caught online cheaters among the top 100 GMs? What I'd like to see is a strength distribution graph of selective cheaters. The average percentage doesn't tell me much.

I am pretty sure that the distribution is not uniform. I imagine the percentage of cheaters is higher at higher ratings, but they must be a minority even there. And at the lower rating bracket (which the original thread was actually about) it is certainly very low.

@ShiningDrongo said in #6: > Do we? How does 0.14% explain 4 caught online cheaters among the top 100 GMs? What I'd like to see is a strength distribution graph of selective cheaters. The average percentage doesn't tell me much. I am pretty sure that the distribution is not uniform. I imagine the percentage of cheaters is higher at higher ratings, but they must be a minority even there. And at the lower rating bracket (which the original thread was actually about) it is certainly very low.