a) Scores are not telling the whole truth. E.g. 1.d4 d6 2.c4 e5 3.dxe5 dxe5 4.Qxd8 scores more for black than for white. Is it a bad move? For sure less principled, but if you look behind the numbers, then you see mostly white choose the opening to get a draw. Against better oponents mostly. So even if black does score above white, looking at the performances and what do you see? White is doing great. So again, i don't care how bad a move 2.Bc4 scores, can you tell me how it performs?
b) the argument a) has a really valid point. So I for my term will agree with you if let's say white has on average 2100 rating in your search, and scores like 1900. Nevertheless for the sake of truth there is also the argument that we are talking about the very best play. So potentially white is better, but only if he plays everything correct while black can choose also 2nd best moves. E.g. opening traps. [I still dont know how to use diagramms, so sorry, but just take me on my word].
There are positions that are highly complicated 'opening traps'. Traps in the sence of with the perfect moves white gets a clear winning position. But should he mess up then you get a really nice advantage. Or in short- he knows everything you lose, otherwise you win. For GMs it is a matter of remembering but for lesser strong oponents, even titled players, they don't even know the refutation from home!
2 'easier' examples:
-1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 e6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 Bb4 - if white does not know exactly how to continue black has the advatange
-1.d4 d5 2.Nc3 Nf6 3.Bf4!? c5 4.e3 (Oleg Bortnyk, WM U20, 2600 Elo plays this always). If you don't know the 'refutation' of 4. ... cxd4! 5.exd4 a6! to play Bf5/g4 and e6 then you are screwed. Not immediatly, but you have a losing position. The way to know thi refutation you need a GM or to have Avrukhs Opening book. If you don't, well then white will have 80-90% winrate in this variation. As GM Bortnyk does. But does this make 2.Nc3 & 3.Bf4 good? No, because it depends only on black not knowing how to react. As well as potentially e4&Bc4 scores only weak against c5&e6 because white does not know how to proceed, not because it is a bad move.
And finally to make it short- there is only 1 way to prove this point. If you think the opening is shit, then prove it by holding equality easy against me (get an even middlegame without problems). If you can't then it is because the line is good. It does not matter whether you are stronger or weaker than I am. If the line is bad, you will hold the position in the first 20 moves. If you cannot, or cannot provide me a line with clearcut equality after 1.e4 c5 2.Bc4 for black, then you ahve to admit that white can potantially play for a win with 2.Bc4 aswell as with the mainlines
b) the argument a) has a really valid point. So I for my term will agree with you if let's say white has on average 2100 rating in your search, and scores like 1900. Nevertheless for the sake of truth there is also the argument that we are talking about the very best play. So potentially white is better, but only if he plays everything correct while black can choose also 2nd best moves. E.g. opening traps. [I still dont know how to use diagramms, so sorry, but just take me on my word].
There are positions that are highly complicated 'opening traps'. Traps in the sence of with the perfect moves white gets a clear winning position. But should he mess up then you get a really nice advantage. Or in short- he knows everything you lose, otherwise you win. For GMs it is a matter of remembering but for lesser strong oponents, even titled players, they don't even know the refutation from home!
2 'easier' examples:
-1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 e6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 Bb4 - if white does not know exactly how to continue black has the advatange
-1.d4 d5 2.Nc3 Nf6 3.Bf4!? c5 4.e3 (Oleg Bortnyk, WM U20, 2600 Elo plays this always). If you don't know the 'refutation' of 4. ... cxd4! 5.exd4 a6! to play Bf5/g4 and e6 then you are screwed. Not immediatly, but you have a losing position. The way to know thi refutation you need a GM or to have Avrukhs Opening book. If you don't, well then white will have 80-90% winrate in this variation. As GM Bortnyk does. But does this make 2.Nc3 & 3.Bf4 good? No, because it depends only on black not knowing how to react. As well as potentially e4&Bc4 scores only weak against c5&e6 because white does not know how to proceed, not because it is a bad move.
And finally to make it short- there is only 1 way to prove this point. If you think the opening is shit, then prove it by holding equality easy against me (get an even middlegame without problems). If you can't then it is because the line is good. It does not matter whether you are stronger or weaker than I am. If the line is bad, you will hold the position in the first 20 moves. If you cannot, or cannot provide me a line with clearcut equality after 1.e4 c5 2.Bc4 for black, then you ahve to admit that white can potantially play for a win with 2.Bc4 aswell as with the mainlines
