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Was World War 2 necessary? (Like Americans joining the war?)

@greenteakitten said ^

II) Despite the stereotypes, America is very much the second best when it comes to being transparent about our ugly history right behind Germany.

Ah, the usual "we in America are the best, even though y'all are too stupid to see it" (conceding to only be "second best" in that instance doesn't change much the self-centred attitude).

We are expected to solve problems with our superpower might

More of the same mentality. No, you are not expected to "solve problems", except for your own problems of course. The only people who think that America is expected to "solve problems" for the world are Americans themselves. In fact most of the world would be very happy if the US didn't try to "solve their problems" for them.

I’m exhausted with the fact that no other country is yelled at on the Internet to the degree that America is

Firstly that's not true: China, Russia, Iran, Israel... But also no other country has as much power as the US, and it's absolutely normal that the more powerful receive more criticism.

@greenteakitten said [^](/forum/redirect/post/zPnZCCZC) > II) Despite the stereotypes, America is very much the second best when it comes to being transparent about our ugly history right behind Germany. Ah, the usual "we in America are the best, even though y'all are too stupid to see it" (conceding to only be "second best" in that instance doesn't change much the self-centred attitude). > We are expected to solve problems with our superpower might More of the same mentality. No, you are not expected to "solve problems", except for your own problems of course. The only people who think that America is expected to "solve problems" for the world are Americans themselves. In fact most of the world would be very happy if the US didn't try to "solve their problems" for them. > I’m exhausted with the fact that no other country is yelled at on the Internet to the degree that America is Firstly that's not true: China, Russia, Iran, Israel... But also no other country has as much power as the US, and it's absolutely normal that the more powerful receive more criticism.

@nomen-nudum said ^

Ah, the usual "we in America are the best, even though y'all are too stupid to see it" (conceding to only be "second best" in that instance doesn't change much the self-centred attitude).

You are very much proving my point. I am not allowed to state facts (as far as textbooks that vary from state to state, I would not be entirely sure, but in terms of common standards nationwide we do indeed have the second best in admitting ugly modern history behind Germany, who leads for obvious reasons) without someone deciding I am arrogant, without once actually fact checking and looking into real curriculum to prove it. Never mind the fact that I have consistently criticized our government here in OTF and half of that rant was me conceding that just like every other country we need reforms lol, I say one nice thing about my own country and all of a sudden I'm an extremist.

More of the same mentality. No, you are not expected to "solve problems", except for your own problems of course. The only people who think that America is expected to "solve problems" for the world are Americans themselves. In fact most of the world would be very happy if the US didn't try to "solve their problems" for them.

Quite the strawman. The original paragraph, if you actually quoted the whole thing, shows that I was talking about World War II in particular, so my statements are indeed historically accurate.

Firstly that's not true: China, Russia, Iran, Israel... But also no other country has as much power as the US, and it's absolutely normal that the more powerful receive more criticism.

Read the whole sentence in context.

I am Chinese American so I can speak on the China part easily. If I was to talk about how advanced China was compared to America and how nice certain things are, no one would bat an eye. I wouldn't be required to apologize for my human rights abuses before speaking. And if someone were to dissent, I could easily point out any racist intentions without excessive backlash. However, as evidenced just now -- I can't say nice things about my own country before that patriotism is intepreted as rogue nationalism.

As far as Iran goes, Iranians appear to have received a good deal of support from the social media I see for their revolution.

Israel of course is the exception here -- but they are actively embroiled in war; America is not, and it makes sense for countries currently at war to be given far more criticism.

Now my original statement: America's citizens are unfairly conflated with our government. We are simultaneously told how powerful and dominant we are and how much we oppress other countries (which is certainly true in many contexts, just often unnecessary to a discussion) but also laughed at for being weak, unable to do anything, etc. and this pattern rings true for just about every issue involving America. Now, that's not to say these statements can't be true or that they are often indeed true. The problem is not necessarily that they are false but that it is disproportionately placed on America. (Ex: "America's uses its massive industry to dominate the market and push out rural farmers! Ooh would you look at that this rural farmer's intelligence is better than 95% of Americans!" Now go back and replace that second statement with China, or India, or any other country. Doesn't it suddenly seem a bit problematic, even with the first statement for context?)

"The powerful get more criticism" is fair, when all the powerful are equally criticized. This is not the case. Europe for all its faults is often given the spotlight for their successes, while America is frequently given it for its faults. Again, I think the fact that I have to clarify so often yet still be misunderstood pretty much proves my point, but I'm not saying America should not be criticized or that we should all be patriotic to a fault. I am suggesting that a lot of these statements on the Internet go way too far and are obviously one sided. As this was a reply to a post, I encourage you to look at what I responded to:

Would have been decimated due to the holocaust yes. The image of the USA would be destroyed., which would make the USA collapse, on its own weight, of lies, and its own atrocities

^^suggests we should have led the Holocaust happen to get an "aha!" moment on the US, which doesn't even make sense because the US wasn't particularly Jewish-friendly during the 1900s either? Not only is this incredibly tone-deaf while pretending to be virtuous, it is also historically inaccurate.

But I guess, according to the allies supporters ignorance is bliss

^^Ignorance of what? That imperialist powers did terrible things as well, despite the fact that not a single soul on this forum has ever denied that?

Everybody is with the allied narrative, but I must mention the atrocities as well.

^^"Narrative"? What an odd word choice.

Anyhow -- please read what I actually wrote in my above posts and start reading it in the context of what I was replying to -- someone who was conflating capitalism with imperialism and then somehow going on a random American rant. Because no; just because orange man wants to be king doesn't mean I need to apologize for praising my own country.
My original response references how time and time again on OTF alone I watch people get praised for criticizing America, even when the context they do it in would be considered extremely problematic with any other country, or how Americans on the Internet feel the need to apologize all the time before saying anything positive about their own country. That's been normalized for far too long when it does not need to be, and forgive me for veering off into Ted talk territory here but if Americans started standing up for themselves instead of waiting till the white nationalists got there we would not have half as bad of a reputation with patriotism as we do now.

@nomen-nudum said [^](/forum/redirect/post/VeCYxgRc) > Ah, the usual "we in America are the best, even though y'all are too stupid to see it" (conceding to only be "second best" in that instance doesn't change much the self-centred attitude). You are very much proving my point. I am not allowed to state facts (as far as textbooks that vary from state to state, I would not be entirely sure, but in terms of common standards nationwide we do indeed have the second best in admitting ugly modern history behind Germany, who leads for obvious reasons) without someone deciding I am arrogant, without once actually fact checking and looking into real curriculum to prove it. Never mind the fact that I have consistently criticized our government here in OTF and half of that rant was me conceding that just like every other country we need reforms lol, I say one nice thing about my own country and all of a sudden I'm an extremist. > More of the same mentality. No, you are not expected to "solve problems", except for your own problems of course. The only people who think that America is expected to "solve problems" for the world are Americans themselves. In fact most of the world would be very happy if the US didn't try to "solve their problems" for them. Quite the strawman. The original paragraph, if you actually quoted the whole thing, shows that I was talking about World War II in particular, so my statements are indeed historically accurate. > Firstly that's not true: China, Russia, Iran, Israel... But also no other country has as much power as the US, and it's absolutely normal that the more powerful receive more criticism. Read the whole sentence in context. I am Chinese American so I can speak on the China part easily. If I was to talk about how advanced China was compared to America and how nice certain things are, no one would bat an eye. I wouldn't be required to apologize for my human rights abuses before speaking. And if someone were to dissent, I could easily point out any racist intentions without excessive backlash. However, as evidenced just now -- I can't say nice things about my own country before that patriotism is intepreted as rogue nationalism. As far as Iran goes, Iranians appear to have received a good deal of support from the social media I see for their revolution. Israel of course is the exception here -- but they are actively embroiled in war; America is not, and it makes sense for countries currently at war to be given far more criticism. Now my original statement: America's citizens are unfairly conflated with our government. We are simultaneously told how powerful and dominant we are and how much we oppress other countries (which is certainly true in many contexts, just often unnecessary to a discussion) but also laughed at for being weak, unable to do anything, etc. and this pattern rings true for just about every issue involving America. Now, that's not to say these statements can't be true or that they are often indeed true. The problem is not necessarily that they are false but that it is *disproportionately* placed on America. (Ex: "America's uses its massive industry to dominate the market and push out rural farmers! Ooh would you look at that this rural farmer's intelligence is better than 95% of Americans!" Now go back and replace that second statement with China, or India, or any other country. Doesn't it suddenly seem a bit problematic, even with the first statement for context?) "The powerful get more criticism" is fair, when *all* the powerful are equally criticized. This is not the case. Europe for all its faults is often given the spotlight for their successes, while America is frequently given it for its faults. Again, I think the fact that I have to clarify so often yet still be misunderstood pretty much proves my point, but I'm not saying America should not be criticized or that we should all be patriotic to a fault. I am suggesting that a lot of these statements on the Internet go way too far and are obviously one sided. As this was a reply to a post, I encourage you to look at what I responded to: >>Would have been decimated due to the holocaust yes. The image of the USA would be destroyed., which would make the USA collapse, on its own weight, of lies, and its own atrocities ^^suggests we should have led the Holocaust happen to get an "aha!" moment on the US, which doesn't even make sense because the US wasn't particularly Jewish-friendly during the 1900s either? Not only is this *incredibly* tone-deaf while pretending to be virtuous, it is also historically inaccurate. >>But I guess, according to the allies supporters ignorance is bliss ^^Ignorance of what? That imperialist powers did terrible things as well, despite the fact that not a single soul on this forum has ever denied that? >>Everybody is with the allied narrative, but I must mention the atrocities as well. ^^"Narrative"? What an odd word choice. --- Anyhow -- please read what I *actually* wrote in my above posts and start reading it in the context of what I was replying to -- someone who was conflating capitalism with imperialism and then somehow going on a random American rant. Because no; just because orange man wants to be king doesn't mean I need to apologize for praising my own country. *My original response references how time and time again on OTF alone I watch people get praised for criticizing America, even when the context they do it in would be considered extremely problematic with any other country, or how Americans on the Internet feel the need to apologize all the time before saying anything positive about their own country. That's been normalized for far too long when it does not need to be, and forgive me for veering off into Ted talk territory here but if Americans started standing up for themselves instead of waiting till the white nationalists got there we would not have half as bad of a reputation with patriotism as we do now.*

@greenteakitten said ^

@Rage698

Okay, I’m tired of seeing the same anti-American propaganda everywhere so let’s set the record straight.

I) You are very much using this as a shield right now and it’s pretty plainly obvious. I keep on seeing this pattern across other forum posts as well and while I'm not trying to be mean here, you can’t keep saying “but America, but Europe did this xyz bad thing” to grant yourself immunity from debating the actual topic at hand. Yes, America had a lot of atrocities, and so did all the Allied powers. That doesn’t change anything about the Holocaust and despite the horrors of the atomic bombs and the famines in the colonies they do not remotely compare with Nazi concentration camps. It also makes no sense to blame capitalism for imperialism since the connection is loose at best, hence why I originally wrote a rebuttal to that.

II) Despite the stereotypes, America is very much the second best when it comes to being transparent about our ugly history right behind Germany. We block the least amount of information (no, that random village in Alabama where all the cousins marry each other doesn’t count as censorship evidence) and this would be very apparent if you read any part of the AP History curriculums. With AP World History being one of the top five most popular classes nationwide, we are very well informed about our treatments of native people in the past as well as the present. When it comes to WWII, we study extensively both the horrors from the Axis such as Unit 731, comfort women, Rape of Nanking, Auschwitz, etc. but also our own contributions; such as the atomic bomb, interment camps for Italian, German, and Japanese Americans, and more. We also go extensively into the treatment of colonies, both during the old colonization period and the new imperialism periods. We are well aware of the Bengal famine, French treatment of Algeria, the Congo horrors, etc. and assuming that because someone is American they are somehow inherently uneducated is just asinine. In other words, you can rest assured that when I talk to you about history I am just as educated as you are about the subject.

III) The screenshots of “stupid Americans not knowing history” go viral for the same reason that any other offensive meme goes viral. I’m tired of people assuming that because Americans tend to take criticism in stride and laugh at our own memes, it’s somehow okay to bash us endlessly. Your flag says you’re Indian; surely you would be aware of this in your own country as well? Does it not frustrate you when people make endless memes about India that are very much racist, yet your own countrymen are filled with so much self-hatred that they just let it slide time and time again? If so, why do you create such a double standard when it comes to America? I hate to agree with any white conservative nationalist but if there’s one thing they’ve gotten right from all the trash they spew it’s that America has been put to a very odd double standard. We are expected to solve problems with our superpower might, which in World War II meant dropping the atomic bombs despite the risks, knowing that if we didn’t do so, we would lose so many more lives on the islands; and criticized for not doing it fast enough (cough Soviets yelling at America for “conserving energy just to come out on top after the war” cough). Yet, when America actually goes in and does something, they are endlessly criticized for doing too much. It’s a line so fine it’s impossible to tread on it. I agree just as much as the next person that racism and many other issues are still a huge problem in our country and they need reform. However, I’m exhausted with the fact that no other country is yelled at on the Internet to the degree that America is, and that other countries are even given praise for the same things America is screamed at for. Point of this whole rant is – your statements that America would have “deserved its downfall” would have been considered extremely problematic if we changed the country name. Let’s not pretend blind hate instead of actually researching what needs to be reformed is something virtuous.

IV) The extent of the Holocaust was actually largely unknown until about 1943 or so when escaped victims finally managed to get their story out more. Suggesting that the Allies were “inefficient" instead of focusing on the horrors of the war crimes of the other side is just victim blaming at its best.

There’s a lot more I could say, but I won’t turn this into a thesis. I just hope you’re willing to change this strange obsession you have with treating anything related to decolonization as angelic and anything related to colonization as demonic. Yes, there is nuance to the subject. No history is black and white. But that doesn't mean we get to paint it all the same shade of grey.

Here is the Answer of your points one by one

  1. I am not denying that the axis did not commit atrocities ,but let’s look at the Numbers, and since you mentioned India as well, let us look at us as well
    Germany 10=20mil
    Japan 10=20mil
    Britain 3 mil
    France na
    USSR not a genocide, but millions of kills, due to recklessness, of Stalin
    USA na
    India na
    AdditionalAllied crimes include , mass bombing of innocent civilians, mass deportation of Germans from East Prussia and pomeneria,silisea,etc.
    Plus, all these crimes were preventable, by the allies, when Germany invaded Austria.
@greenteakitten said [^](/forum/redirect/post/zPnZCCZC) > @Rage698 > > Okay, I’m tired of seeing the same anti-American propaganda everywhere so let’s set the record straight. > > I) You are very much using this as a shield right now and it’s pretty plainly obvious. I keep on seeing this pattern across other forum posts as well and while I'm not trying to be mean here, you can’t keep saying “but America, but Europe did this xyz bad thing” to grant yourself immunity from debating the actual topic at hand. Yes, America had a lot of atrocities, and so did all the Allied powers. That doesn’t change anything about the Holocaust and despite the horrors of the atomic bombs and the famines in the colonies they do not remotely compare with Nazi concentration camps. It also makes no sense to blame capitalism for imperialism since the connection is loose at best, hence why I originally wrote a rebuttal to that. > > II) Despite the stereotypes, America is very much the second best when it comes to being transparent about our ugly history right behind Germany. We block the least amount of information (no, that random village in Alabama where all the cousins marry each other doesn’t count as censorship evidence) and this would be very apparent if you read any part of the AP History curriculums. With AP World History being one of the top five most popular classes nationwide, we are very well informed about our treatments of native people in the past as well as the present. When it comes to WWII, we study extensively both the horrors from the Axis such as Unit 731, comfort women, Rape of Nanking, Auschwitz, etc. but also our own contributions; such as the atomic bomb, interment camps for Italian, German, and Japanese Americans, and more. We also go extensively into the treatment of colonies, both during the old colonization period and the new imperialism periods. We are well aware of the Bengal famine, French treatment of Algeria, the Congo horrors, etc. and assuming that because someone is American they are somehow inherently uneducated is just asinine. In other words, you can rest assured that when I talk to you about history I am just as educated as you are about the subject. > > III) The screenshots of “stupid Americans not knowing history” go viral for the same reason that any other offensive meme goes viral. I’m tired of people assuming that because Americans tend to take criticism in stride and laugh at our own memes, it’s somehow okay to bash us endlessly. Your flag says you’re Indian; surely you would be aware of this in your own country as well? Does it not frustrate you when people make endless memes about India that are very much racist, yet your own countrymen are filled with so much self-hatred that they just let it slide time and time again? If so, why do you create such a double standard when it comes to America? I hate to agree with any white conservative nationalist but if there’s one thing they’ve gotten right from all the trash they spew it’s that America has been put to a very odd double standard. We are expected to solve problems with our superpower might, which in World War II meant dropping the atomic bombs despite the risks, knowing that if we didn’t do so, we would lose so many more lives on the islands; and criticized for not doing it fast enough (*cough* Soviets yelling at America for “conserving energy just to come out on top after the war” *cough*). Yet, when America actually goes in and does something, they are endlessly criticized for doing too much. It’s a line so fine it’s impossible to tread on it. I agree just as much as the next person that racism and many other issues are still a huge problem in our country and they need reform. However, I’m exhausted with the fact that no other country is yelled at on the Internet to the degree that America is, and that other countries are even given *praise* for the same things America is screamed at for. Point of this whole rant is – your statements that America would have “deserved its downfall” would have been considered extremely problematic if we changed the country name. Let’s not pretend blind hate instead of actually researching what needs to be reformed is something virtuous. > > IV) The extent of the Holocaust was actually largely unknown until about 1943 or so when escaped victims finally managed to get their story out more. Suggesting that the Allies were “inefficient" instead of focusing on the horrors of the war crimes of the other side is just victim blaming at its best. > > There’s a lot more I could say, but I won’t turn this into a thesis. I just hope you’re willing to change this strange obsession you have with treating anything related to decolonization as angelic and anything related to colonization as demonic. **Yes, there is nuance to the subject. No history is black and white. But that doesn't mean we get to paint it all the same shade of grey.** Here is the Answer of your points one by one 1. I am not denying that the axis did not commit atrocities ,but let’s look at the Numbers, and since you mentioned India as well, let us look at us as well Germany 10=20mil Japan 10=20mil Britain 3 mil France na USSR not a genocide, but millions of kills, due to recklessness, of Stalin USA na India na AdditionalAllied crimes include , mass bombing of innocent civilians, mass deportation of Germans from East Prussia and pomeneria,silisea,etc. Plus, all these crimes were preventable, by the allies, when Germany invaded Austria.

Secondly, being transparent about your ugly history, you never made Britain apologise for all the atrocities, including 3 million people killed unnecessarily, just because of Churchill’s, comment, if you are so transparent, why didn’t you defend the central African countries, when the CFA deal was being signed, jio And thirdly, if World War II was caused by the treaty of Versaille and one man and his small group, then why did you blame the German people for it, so we should also blame the British, if you want to play the blame. game. lastly , you taught partially incorrect history to German people, saying the Allies were heroes

Secondly, being transparent about your ugly history, you never made Britain apologise for all the atrocities, including 3 million people killed unnecessarily, just because of Churchill’s, comment, if you are so transparent, why didn’t you defend the central African countries, when the CFA deal was being signed, jio And thirdly, if World War II was caused by the treaty of Versaille and one man and his small group, then why did you blame the German people for it, so we should also blame the British, if you want to play the blame. game. lastly , you taught partially incorrect history to German people, saying the Allies were heroes

@Rage698

Okay at this point you're just ragebaiting me with strawmen but it just so happens that I'll be cramming for history exams tomorrow...so you can get your response then, complete with screenshots of the official curriculum :)

@Rage698 Okay at this point you're just ragebaiting me with strawmen but it just so happens that I'll be cramming for history exams tomorrow...so you can get your response then, complete with screenshots of the official curriculum :)

@greenteakitten said ^

@Rage698

Okay at this point you're just ragebaiting me with strawmen but it just so happens that I'll be cramming for history exams tomorrow...so you can get your response then, complete with screenshots of the official curriculum :)

Lol cramming for AP?

@greenteakitten said [^](/forum/redirect/post/S7kNgvGZ) > @Rage698 > > Okay at this point you're just ragebaiting me with strawmen but it just so happens that I'll be cramming for history exams tomorrow...so you can get your response then, complete with screenshots of the official curriculum :) Lol cramming for AP?

Yup haha -- got AP bio practice tests tomorrow though so we gotta cram for that first because someone forgot to study lol :)

Yup haha -- got AP bio practice tests tomorrow though so we gotta cram for that first because someone forgot to study lol :)

@greenteakitten said :

I am not allowed to state facts (...) without someone deciding I am arrogant, without once actually fact checking and looking into real curriculum to prove it

I mean you do realise that every USian who says that the US is the best always comes up with justifications and facts to "prove" it?

The point is in my experience no other nationality (*) is constantly boasting about how their country is the best and how they got everything right and how they know better than everyone and how the rest of the world is terribly misunderstanding them. It's a pattern. I am not saying that you were personally arrogant, but your comment definitely fitted in the pattern.

(*) Except perhaps Germany. Ironically the US is so self-centered for winning WWII, and Germany for losing it.

If I was to talk about how advanced China was compared to America and how nice certain things are, no one would bat an eye. I wouldn't be required to apologize for my human rights abuses before speaking.

I disagree. From my personal observation if you were to talk about how great certain aspects of China are then more often than not someone would start with the chapter "but the Uyghurs, but Taïwan, but workers conditions..."

America's citizens are unfairly conflated with our government.

From my observation, the problem is not that US citizens are conflated with their government (unfairly or not). The problem is that whenever someone criticises" the US", everyone understands that they are talking about the US government, except for USians, who take it personally and think that this person is attacking US citizens in general, unfairly conflating them with the government.

That said, yes, I am sure that there are instances when people are being mocked rather than the government, but I haven't seen this as being especially predominant.

"The powerful get more criticism" is fair, when all the powerful are equally criticized. This is not the case.

Ok so your point is that the US is treated differently than other countries in online discussion forums, and that it's unfair. But even without going in the question of whether that's unfair or not, if it is true that the US is treated differently, there must be an explanation for it, right? Things don't just spontaneously happen without a cause or reason or explanation. So what, in your opinion, sets the US appart from all other countries, that might explain why they are treated differently?

@greenteakitten said : > I am not allowed to state facts (...) without someone deciding I am arrogant, without once actually fact checking and looking into real curriculum to prove it I mean you do realise that every USian who says that the US is the best always comes up with justifications and facts to "prove" it? The point is in my experience no other nationality (*) is constantly boasting about how their country is the best and how they got everything right and how they know better than everyone and how the rest of the world is terribly misunderstanding them. It's a pattern. I am not saying that you were personally arrogant, but your comment definitely fitted in the pattern. --- (*) Except perhaps Germany. Ironically the US is so self-centered for winning WWII, and Germany for losing it. --- > If I was to talk about how advanced China was compared to America and how nice certain things are, no one would bat an eye. I wouldn't be required to apologize for my human rights abuses before speaking. I disagree. From my personal observation if you were to talk about how great certain aspects of China are then more often than not someone would start with the chapter "but the Uyghurs, but Taïwan, but workers conditions..." --- > America's citizens are unfairly conflated with our government. From my observation, the problem is not that US citizens are conflated with their government (unfairly or not). The problem is that whenever someone criticises" the US", everyone understands that they are talking about the US government, except for USians, who take it personally and think that this person is attacking US citizens in general, unfairly conflating them with the government. That said, yes, I am sure that there are instances when *people* are being mocked rather than the government, but I haven't seen this as being especially predominant. --- > "The powerful get more criticism" is fair, when all the powerful are equally criticized. This is not the case. Ok so your point is that the US is treated differently than other countries in online discussion forums, and that it's unfair. But even without going in the question of whether that's unfair or not, if it is true that the US is treated differently, there must be an explanation for it, right? Things don't just spontaneously happen without a cause or reason or explanation. So what, in your opinion, sets the US appart from all other countries, that might explain why they are treated differently?

"if World War II was caused by the treaty of Versaille and one man and his small group, then why did you blame the German people for it, so we should also blame the British"

  • No the British and the Americans opposed the harsh terms of the Versailles Treaty, it were the French, especially Jean de Lattre de Tassigny who insisted on severe punishment of Germany. The German workers suffered from it, and thus voted for Hitler who promised to undo it.
"if World War II was caused by the treaty of Versaille and one man and his small group, then why did you blame the German people for it, so we should also blame the British" * No the British and the Americans opposed the harsh terms of the Versailles Treaty, it were the French, especially Jean de Lattre de Tassigny who insisted on severe punishment of Germany. The German workers suffered from it, and thus voted for Hitler who promised to undo it.

@tpr said ^

"if World War II was caused by the treaty of Versaille and one man and his small group, then why did you blame the German people for it, so we should also blame the British"

  • No the British and the Americans opposed the harsh terms of the Versailles Treaty, it were the French, especially Jean de Lattre de Tassigny who insisted on severe punishment of Germany. The German workers suffered from it, and thus voted for Hitler who promised to undo it.

Yes, but the British could have prevented the war.

@tpr said [^](/forum/redirect/post/MPM2aQCS) > "if World War II was caused by the treaty of Versaille and one man and his small group, then why did you blame the German people for it, so we should also blame the British" > * No the British and the Americans opposed the harsh terms of the Versailles Treaty, it were the French, especially Jean de Lattre de Tassigny who insisted on severe punishment of Germany. The German workers suffered from it, and thus voted for Hitler who promised to undo it. Yes, but the British could have prevented the war.