@CSKA_Moscou said in #810:
> for the moment Lichess boycott st louis chess club but not the uscf.
Ok, thank you, that's interesting...
Given the STLCC statement that @Gingersquirrelnuts linked, showing that they appear to be at least showing some remorse and trying to improve their safeguarding policies, and the continued frankly appalling attitude and behaviour from US Chess, is there a reason for this?
@QueenRosieMary said in #811:
> Ok, thank you, that's interesting...
>
> Given the STLCC statement that @Gingersquirrelnuts linked, showing that they appear to be at least showing some remorse and trying to improve their safeguarding policies, and the continued frankly appalling attitude and behaviour from US Chess, is there a reason for this?
in every federation, like everywhere, you have good people and bad people. St Louis is a “private” tournament, closed and not national. uscf is a national federation, boycotting a national federation is boycotting a sporting state. and therefore is this necessary to block with such a boycott feducational institutions aiming to promote chess in the US ? However, Lichess is a site officially recognized by the French Ministry of Education. therefore, it is a tough decision, because it would be good to boycott the administration of the federation or at least the decision makers, while leaving open the positive educational events
There are already tools in place to get rid of such players: reporting and eventually banning. My issue is that people who got harrassed want to have policies in place which prevent harrassment. Even though I would favor that, such policies would be too demanding since it means that everyone would be screened before even opening an account on, e.g. Lichess. And even then harrassement can happen.
So even though harrassment is unpleasant, people have to accept that it cannot be ruled out.
@ZeFlammenwerferHanz said in #813:
> There are already tools in place to get rid of such players: reporting and eventually banning.
There are, although these are reactive measures rather than proactive ones.
> My issue is that people who got harrassed want to have policies in place which prevent harrassment.
Yes, of course we do...
>Even though I would favor that, such policies would be too demanding since it means that everyone would be screened before even opening an account on, e.g. Lichess.
Well, it's good that you favour that idea, but of course, that is more than likely beyond the resources of a free, charity-run website as we both know
>And even then harrassement can happen.
Yes, of course, nothing is 100%. I am a realist, but I still think it is a worthwhile cause to raise awareness of this issue and discuss ideas about how to tackle, prevent, and deal with it.
> So even though harrassment is unpleasant...
Have you ever been harassed? And I don't just mean verbally abused or trolled... It is rather more than just "unpleasant" on occasion...
>... people have to accept that it cannot be ruled out.
Sorry, whilst I accept that the world and indeed Lichess will not ever be a 100% harassment-free zone, I don't agree with the sentiment that we should not strive to improve the situation.
Sticking with the topic, the harassment and abuse of female chess players both over the board and online is a MASSIVE issue, and a hindrance to the participation, welfare, and safety of women and girls in chess. It is I think a symptom of our culture and society but just expressed in a chess context. In order to effect change, we need to change the culture, and that is never quick or easy.
I will continue to report it, talk about it, and advocate for women and girls in chess as long as it remains an issue.
You can choose to do your part or accept the status quo and get on with your day.
Even now, I see some encouraging signs, a male team leader spoke up in an arena chat when someone made a sexist comment, telling them it wasn't Tinder and they had the wrong website. Speaking to this person afterwards to thank them for getting involved and not just standing by and letting it go, they said this:
"We need more female players on the platform, so we need to protect the regulars". He is right, we need more women and girls on Lichess. I didn't take offence at his wording either, about "protection", since I am sure he knows I can take care of myself. However, the fact that I received moral support and the fact that he spoke out was definitely appreciated. The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing, or so the saying goes. Actually, according to some sources, although the eighteenth-century Irish philosopher and statesman Edmund Burke may not have said those exact words, he did say something similar in his “Thoughts on the Cause of the Present Discontents” (1770):
"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle."
still there, suprised its not archived
The thing is that bullying exists no matter who you are. When someone wants to insult you he/she will use anything they know about you. If you're a female then the insult is gonna be based on that fact. If you're from a poor country then it's gonna be that. Whatever information they have about you, can be used as a base for an insult. And it is not just in chess. I've played a lot of different games online. Bullying is everywhere and it's not just sexism.
@NeverNothing
Of course bullying exists everywhere and it's not just sexism (and I say this out of experience on other online games!) - although I believe that this blog was talking more specifically about sexual harassment in this case.
@greenteakitten said in #817:
> @NeverNothing
>
> Of course bullying exists everywhere and it's not just sexism (and I say this out of experience on other online games!) - although I believe that this blog was talking more specifically about sexual harassment in this case.
My point was that there is no point to concentrate specifically on sexism because the reason for bullying is not that someone is a woman.
@NeverNothing said in #818:
> My point was that there is no point to concentrate specifically on sexism because the reason for bullying is not that someone is a woman.
In bullying, no. I completely agree with you on that.
In sexual harassment it very much is though...and this blog specifically concentrates on sexism and sexual harassment.
@NeverNothing said in #818:
> My point was that there is no point to concentrate specifically on sexism because the reason for bullying is not that someone is a woman.
Can I ask you something?
Are you a woman? Even if you aren't, have you ever experienced gender-based harassment or violence?
If not, I can understand more why you can't differentiate between bullying and this.
As @greenteakitten said, the reason for sexual harassment of women is very much because they are women, the clue is in the name.
Bullying is of course also wrong for whatever reason, but is a separate topic in this context.