Minimum time per move please

@Awum said in #19:
> Think about it. You can’t enter a premove until after your last move goes in, right? The lag compensation meanwhile adds the lag time back to your clock. So if you have a longer lag than your opponent, you have more time in between sending out your move and getting your opponent’s move back, to put in your next premove. It’s true on each and every turn. It won’t be much but it will be enough to make a difference, to allow you to get in ahead of your opponent and string together zeroes with little or no chance that your opponent can do the same.
When I saw this paragraph, my first idea was: "Are we still talking about chess here?" (And a quick peek at your profile did not exactly dispel my doubts.)

@mkubecek said in #21:
> "Are we still talking about chess here?"
Not exactly. We're talking about how to make lichess better. Talking about chess in general belongs to another subforum.

> (And a quick peek at your profile did not exactly dispel my doubts.)
Can you please clarify what you mean by that?

@lakfish said in #22:
> Can you please clarify what you mean by that?
The user who started this thread has not played any game of chess on this site since May 2021.

@mkubecek said in #23:
> The user who started this thread has not played any game of chess on this site since May 2021.
Someone once asked me not to make personal remarks in the forum. Very ironical they're doing it themselves.
Moreover, everyone has their preferences, and you're talking like antichess has no time control. Suggestions are welcome, always, regardless of the suggester, that's what the forum is for.

@lakfish said in #24:
> Someone once asked me not to make personal remarks in the forum. Very ironical they're doing it themselves.
That's nothing personal, it's everyone's choice what they want to play and it doesn't make them better or worse. But I take it as a sign that this whole discussion was not really about playing chess from the start which makes it irrelevant for me.

@mkubecek said in #25:
> That's nothing personal,
What do you think pointing out someone hasn't played (normal) chess in a discussion regarding premoves is?

> this whole discussion was not really about playing chess from the start which makes it irrelevant for me.
I think i told you that before. Fine, I'll do it again: we aren't talking about "chess" here, this discussion is an attempt to make lichess better. And if you're so worried about chess, you should be advocating against premoves because that's not how (true) chess works. (Ps. I mean no hate)

well problem is you think your proposal would make lichess better, quite many think would make worse and large body of people could not care less. Hence this kind of proposal will never go into work list of lichess developers.

Like multi premove either. It has been proposed several times as has been this small reduction in clock for each pre-move as well.

@mkubecek said in #25:
> That's nothing personal, it's everyone's choice what they want to play and it doesn't make them better or worse. But I take it as a sign that this whole discussion was not really about playing chess from the start which makes it irrelevant for me.

Some folks don't play variants on the same account they play chess. The assumption you made by looking at this account was inaccurate.

The example I gave was antichess, but the problem exists in any game where players with different connection speeds are trying to make premoves against one another. The player with the slower connection gains a time advantage, allowing them to complete many more moves than their opponent.

That won't be limited to variants. If you play bullet, there's a good chance you have lost to someone without realizing that they beat you with that advantage. That's part of the issue, it's hard to notice in real time, unless it is extreme.

@petri999 said in #17:
> chess.com allows multiple pre-moves and that can be even more devasting in a fast game. Lihchess 0 move takes more effort as you have wait previous move to be executed before you can enter next one.

That's not quite true, in an important way. Lichess only makes you wait until your prior move has been sent to the server before you can enter the next one.

That matters because Lichess compensates you for your lag time to the server, so that players will generally experience the same time to respond to opponent's last move. BUT, if you aren't waiting for your opponent's last move (i.e., you are premoving) that means that a player with a greater lag has more time in which to enter their move.

@Awum said in #28:
> Some folks don't play variants on the same account they play chess.
I can't say I understand why someone would do that but it does not really matter. Pity both of you focused on the minor sidenote and completely missed the point of comment #21. So I'll try to be more clear.

It makes me very sad that so many people here no longer care about the game of chess and focus of technicalities of making their opponent flag as if it were the primary goal of the game. And the paragraph from #19 I quoted in #21 illustrates that. When I'm in a winning position and my opponent does not resign, my only concern (regarding the clock) is whether I'll be able to convert my advantage and finish the game within the time I have left. Why should I care about my opponent's time, his/her premoving or how fast he/she makes the moves? And if I'm not in a winning position, why should I expect - or even feel entitled - to win in the first place? Seriously, I don't understand how anyone can be proud of a win on time in a losing position (or a hoplesly drawish endgame, FWIW). But reading the discussions here it sometimes feels as if winning by timeout were the primary point of a chess game.