@Thinkus Does it matter? Does that have any relevance to the topic?
It's never been my experience that these forums are toxic. Discussion on controversial topics gets heated, sure. Sometimes they get out of hand. I don't think that qualifies as toxic however. Only very rarely do I see someone being a **** just for the hell of it. On non-controversial topics people almost always behave politely and on anything chess related people are mostly kind, helpful and supportive.
Go to the Magic the Gathering Arena forums if you want to see what toxic looks like.
Go to the Magic the Gathering Arena forums if you want to see what toxic looks like.
Saw several of your recent posts & had a look at your profile.
- You claim to have discovered a "deep learning" chess algorithm that makes people stronger (with no data to back it up)
- You developed a chess app, exploiting the popularity of the Netflix series without licensing it (please correct if I'm wrong)
- You claim to be FIDE 2001 but are nowhere near that in strength
Don't know what incident you meant specifically, but if you're gonna grab people's attention without delivering substance, you're gonna meet resentment.
- You claim to have discovered a "deep learning" chess algorithm that makes people stronger (with no data to back it up)
- You developed a chess app, exploiting the popularity of the Netflix series without licensing it (please correct if I'm wrong)
- You claim to be FIDE 2001 but are nowhere near that in strength
Don't know what incident you meant specifically, but if you're gonna grab people's attention without delivering substance, you're gonna meet resentment.
@michuk said in #1:
> What is the point of a Forum where fellow users are bullied, intimidated and made to feel their own opinions are not worth anything.
>
> Why is this forum so toxic and responses so aggressive, snarky and sarcastic?
So, I've been here a while now and can relate a couple instances of my own to support your testimony ...
The answer to your question, which makes most sense to me is brief and very simple - an adult, one who is not particularly skilled at chess, and perhaps one with a 'certain type' of internet browsing profile, might be considered a liability by that chess site's compliance officer, and therefore he may be encouraged to seek his social forums elsewhere ...
Various agents, either real humans or bots could be used as effective assets in accomplishing the above conjectured 'desirable outcome' ..
In any case, if you come here to just play chess and never enter the forums, the same may happen to the user profiled above, by employing similar agents to keep them locked in the ratings dungeon, for instance ...
These are all invitations to leave the site and find your social networks elsewhere.
And in today's world I can hardly find any fault in such a policy ...
> What is the point of a Forum where fellow users are bullied, intimidated and made to feel their own opinions are not worth anything.
>
> Why is this forum so toxic and responses so aggressive, snarky and sarcastic?
So, I've been here a while now and can relate a couple instances of my own to support your testimony ...
The answer to your question, which makes most sense to me is brief and very simple - an adult, one who is not particularly skilled at chess, and perhaps one with a 'certain type' of internet browsing profile, might be considered a liability by that chess site's compliance officer, and therefore he may be encouraged to seek his social forums elsewhere ...
Various agents, either real humans or bots could be used as effective assets in accomplishing the above conjectured 'desirable outcome' ..
In any case, if you come here to just play chess and never enter the forums, the same may happen to the user profiled above, by employing similar agents to keep them locked in the ratings dungeon, for instance ...
These are all invitations to leave the site and find your social networks elsewhere.
And in today's world I can hardly find any fault in such a policy ...
I don't know about this guy, but personally, I invented scrambled eggs and a precursor to the Rubicks Cube, a painted, multi-colored wood block, it just didn't spin.
@zozzers said in #14:
> Saw several of your recent posts & had a look at your profile.
>
> - You claim to have discovered a "deep learning" chess algorithm that makes people stronger (with no data to back it up)
> - You developed a chess app, exploiting the popularity of the Netflix series without licensing it (please correct if I'm wrong)
> - You claim to be FIDE 2001 but are nowhere near that in strength
>
> Don't know what incident you meant specifically, but if you're gonna grab people's attention without delivering substance, you're gonna meet resentment.
So guys here is an example of the type of "discrediting" type of post by @zozzers , thanks buddy it is so archetypal.
You ignore treating the topic directly and instead busy yourself with undermining me and my credibility before swinging back to it and saying my lack of creditability is the source of my woes. You asked for it type of response. Thanks for this perfect example of the toxicity I was referring to, admittedly a mild example but still the type of response that objectifies someone, shames them and sends them on their way with their tail between their legs.
Lets take your points one by one.
> - You claim to have discovered a "deep learning" chess algorithm that makes people stronger (with no data to back it up)
It is a discussion about the theoretical probability or improbability of such an algorithm existing. It is a conjecture and I am asking for a theoretical discussion, so I don't need to provide specific evidence though I point to my own rating rise which then gets discredited and misrepresented by at one person who was posting a reply to the topic. If you looked closely at my profile you may have seen an article about some weird puzzle training algorithm cube thingy that I gave a link to but maybe you didn't look that deep. However the topic wasn't concerned with specifics it was talking about could it even be possible, does that even make sense as a reality thinking it through.
> - You developed a chess app, exploiting the popularity of the Netflix series without licensing it (please correct if I'm wrong)
I am not selling the app or advertising anything and I got permission from Netflix to do it and permission from the copyright owner for the images used and music sampled. Sorry I did my due diligence and that is why the site is still up I guess since Netflix even contributed to how I should give them credit and which images and samples they were happy for me to use.
> - You claim to be FIDE 2001 but are nowhere near that in strength
I thought I was being asked what FIDE rating I thought I was and I think I am 2001 because my recent results show I'm at that level. @lichess can easily check this by cross referencing my actual FIDE just like you did. I rarely play FIDE events and so that doesn't reflect my true strength. What has that got to do with the topics I post on the forum. Do I deserve to be abused and mistreated because I put a rating that I believe I am at rather than my actual rating?
I hope you see if from my perspective at least try to, when I post something try to tackle it with the subject matter and not using other information you gather or assume to attack the person making the topic or post on the forum.
Lets live and let live. I shouldn't have to justify my existence to you before you take my posts seriously. Don't assume the worst about me because I dared to use the Lichess forum.
> Saw several of your recent posts & had a look at your profile.
>
> - You claim to have discovered a "deep learning" chess algorithm that makes people stronger (with no data to back it up)
> - You developed a chess app, exploiting the popularity of the Netflix series without licensing it (please correct if I'm wrong)
> - You claim to be FIDE 2001 but are nowhere near that in strength
>
> Don't know what incident you meant specifically, but if you're gonna grab people's attention without delivering substance, you're gonna meet resentment.
So guys here is an example of the type of "discrediting" type of post by @zozzers , thanks buddy it is so archetypal.
You ignore treating the topic directly and instead busy yourself with undermining me and my credibility before swinging back to it and saying my lack of creditability is the source of my woes. You asked for it type of response. Thanks for this perfect example of the toxicity I was referring to, admittedly a mild example but still the type of response that objectifies someone, shames them and sends them on their way with their tail between their legs.
Lets take your points one by one.
> - You claim to have discovered a "deep learning" chess algorithm that makes people stronger (with no data to back it up)
It is a discussion about the theoretical probability or improbability of such an algorithm existing. It is a conjecture and I am asking for a theoretical discussion, so I don't need to provide specific evidence though I point to my own rating rise which then gets discredited and misrepresented by at one person who was posting a reply to the topic. If you looked closely at my profile you may have seen an article about some weird puzzle training algorithm cube thingy that I gave a link to but maybe you didn't look that deep. However the topic wasn't concerned with specifics it was talking about could it even be possible, does that even make sense as a reality thinking it through.
> - You developed a chess app, exploiting the popularity of the Netflix series without licensing it (please correct if I'm wrong)
I am not selling the app or advertising anything and I got permission from Netflix to do it and permission from the copyright owner for the images used and music sampled. Sorry I did my due diligence and that is why the site is still up I guess since Netflix even contributed to how I should give them credit and which images and samples they were happy for me to use.
> - You claim to be FIDE 2001 but are nowhere near that in strength
I thought I was being asked what FIDE rating I thought I was and I think I am 2001 because my recent results show I'm at that level. @lichess can easily check this by cross referencing my actual FIDE just like you did. I rarely play FIDE events and so that doesn't reflect my true strength. What has that got to do with the topics I post on the forum. Do I deserve to be abused and mistreated because I put a rating that I believe I am at rather than my actual rating?
I hope you see if from my perspective at least try to, when I post something try to tackle it with the subject matter and not using other information you gather or assume to attack the person making the topic or post on the forum.
Lets live and let live. I shouldn't have to justify my existence to you before you take my posts seriously. Don't assume the worst about me because I dared to use the Lichess forum.
@hardbitten said in #16:
> I don't know about this guy, but personally, I invented scrambled eggs and a precursor to the Rubicks Cube, a painted, multi-colored wood block, it just didn't spin.
Thanks for the example of dismissive sarcasm, it is a great example of how some people ridicule others on the forum, though admittedly this is mild, almost family friendly and actually funny version of the negative comments I normally receive. Thanks @hardbitten for providing an example.
> I don't know about this guy, but personally, I invented scrambled eggs and a precursor to the Rubicks Cube, a painted, multi-colored wood block, it just didn't spin.
Thanks for the example of dismissive sarcasm, it is a great example of how some people ridicule others on the forum, though admittedly this is mild, almost family friendly and actually funny version of the negative comments I normally receive. Thanks @hardbitten for providing an example.
I find the forum is pretty good.
There's definitely some sarcastic humour, but also lots of supportive and helpful posts. There's the occasional unwanted and unneeded post. Those get reported and deleted pretty quickly.
Here some examples
lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/lichess-rating--chesscom-rating--uscf-rating--fide-rating
supportive and helpful
lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/slav-semi-slav-opening-question
helpful
lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/why-do-i-suck-2
I just very quickly browsed it. it looked supportive with some sarcastic humour. "you suck because you don't play atomic"
So here's a question for you. If you're getting toxic replies when other people aren't, why is that?
There's definitely some sarcastic humour, but also lots of supportive and helpful posts. There's the occasional unwanted and unneeded post. Those get reported and deleted pretty quickly.
Here some examples
lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/lichess-rating--chesscom-rating--uscf-rating--fide-rating
supportive and helpful
lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/slav-semi-slav-opening-question
helpful
lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/why-do-i-suck-2
I just very quickly browsed it. it looked supportive with some sarcastic humour. "you suck because you don't play atomic"
So here's a question for you. If you're getting toxic replies when other people aren't, why is that?
@h2b2 said in #19:
> I find the forum is pretty good.
> There's definitely some sarcastic humour, but also lots of supportive and helpful posts. There's the occasional unwanted and unneeded post. Those get reported and deleted pretty quickly.
>
> Here some examples
>
> lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/lichess-rating--chesscom-rating--uscf-rating--fide-rating
>
> supportive and helpful
>
> lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/slav-semi-slav-opening-question
>
> helpful
>
> lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/why-do-i-suck-2
>
> I just very quickly browsed it. it looked supportive with some sarcastic humour. "you suck because you don't play atomic"
>
> So here's a question for you. If you're getting toxic replies when other people aren't, why is that?
Firstly @h2b2 thank you for treating me with respect and engaging with me and the topic in a neutral way to understand what I am saying I experienced.
I think why I would get these responses and others wouldn't is simple, I do have positive to response to a small number of my topics but most of my topics are never small and mundane they are big and epic. I talk about inventing this and making that and discovering this and the other. Whether anyone believes I am some sort of Elon Musk level genius in chess tech, most people get annoyed when someone is blowing their own trumpet. I understand that. However what I am describing to you goes beyond jealousy or annoyance at an arrogant egotistical self proclaimed genius.
If the stuff I say is fake go on prove it, take the puzzle cube show how stupid the idea is and how rubbish it was implemented and how it would never work. Make a Youtube video about it. Just posting abuse about me and my ideas and apps without having even tried them or having tried them looking for little things to pick holes in them is infantile.
One of the criticism of my Puzzle Cube is that it is buggy and laggy, but we sit 1 minute waiting to get paired in a Lichess Arena Tournament on Lichess and nobody finds that weird that it takes that long and that is lag by design which is the worst form of lag because we are literally making people wait because we have no imagination to dynamically pair people in real time and give them feedback on how soon they will get re-paired which would be a really good way to handle Lichess Arena tournament pairing. We have 6 minutes or something to go in a Lichess Arena tournament and you literally wait the 6 minutes to be told be Lichess that the tournament is over nobody finds that buggy. When you mention it you are destroyed and a told you have no right to express an opinion because you put 2001 elo in a self verification form which I thought was hilarious.
I feel a small minority of the Lichess users are controlling what is seen as good or not good on the Forum and the silent majority is too afraid to say anything because they don't want to become the target.
> I find the forum is pretty good.
> There's definitely some sarcastic humour, but also lots of supportive and helpful posts. There's the occasional unwanted and unneeded post. Those get reported and deleted pretty quickly.
>
> Here some examples
>
> lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/lichess-rating--chesscom-rating--uscf-rating--fide-rating
>
> supportive and helpful
>
> lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/slav-semi-slav-opening-question
>
> helpful
>
> lichess.org/forum/general-chess-discussion/why-do-i-suck-2
>
> I just very quickly browsed it. it looked supportive with some sarcastic humour. "you suck because you don't play atomic"
>
> So here's a question for you. If you're getting toxic replies when other people aren't, why is that?
Firstly @h2b2 thank you for treating me with respect and engaging with me and the topic in a neutral way to understand what I am saying I experienced.
I think why I would get these responses and others wouldn't is simple, I do have positive to response to a small number of my topics but most of my topics are never small and mundane they are big and epic. I talk about inventing this and making that and discovering this and the other. Whether anyone believes I am some sort of Elon Musk level genius in chess tech, most people get annoyed when someone is blowing their own trumpet. I understand that. However what I am describing to you goes beyond jealousy or annoyance at an arrogant egotistical self proclaimed genius.
If the stuff I say is fake go on prove it, take the puzzle cube show how stupid the idea is and how rubbish it was implemented and how it would never work. Make a Youtube video about it. Just posting abuse about me and my ideas and apps without having even tried them or having tried them looking for little things to pick holes in them is infantile.
One of the criticism of my Puzzle Cube is that it is buggy and laggy, but we sit 1 minute waiting to get paired in a Lichess Arena Tournament on Lichess and nobody finds that weird that it takes that long and that is lag by design which is the worst form of lag because we are literally making people wait because we have no imagination to dynamically pair people in real time and give them feedback on how soon they will get re-paired which would be a really good way to handle Lichess Arena tournament pairing. We have 6 minutes or something to go in a Lichess Arena tournament and you literally wait the 6 minutes to be told be Lichess that the tournament is over nobody finds that buggy. When you mention it you are destroyed and a told you have no right to express an opinion because you put 2001 elo in a self verification form which I thought was hilarious.
I feel a small minority of the Lichess users are controlling what is seen as good or not good on the Forum and the silent majority is too afraid to say anything because they don't want to become the target.
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