#9:
Ugh, you are saying swiss tournaments were cast aside so that the stupid arena marathons would be easier to run? How gross.
And yes, I understand there is wait time. I've played tournaments on many other servers, but never an arena style tournament. Or warhorse style, or whatever it was called on chesscube when they first started.
Honestly I believe Swiss tournaments are excellent for players seeking to improve at chess; they're just difficult to implement and when Lichess had them, they were quite unpopular.
I don't think they can be that difficult to implement when pretty much every other chess site has them, and the population of lichess is exponentially larger than it was when they were here last time, so it's likely that a critical mass could be achieved much easier now.
I didn't know lichess at that time, but I do think 'unpopular' might mean different things. Please consider:
- there is a much larger userbase now
- one 30+30 equals many 15s games in terms of time played, and way more in terms of brainpower used, so don't judge by the number of games played
- popularity depends not only on the demand, but also on what is offered. Some small things that might make multiple days round-based tournaments more played, could be:
* an easy way to schedule games; for example use the 'challenges' button to show your next game with 'play now' or 'suggest a time' options
* hold a yearly direct elimination lichess masters tournament
Could you explain what makes them difficult to implement?
A continuously flexible swiss ladder system could pick the next appropriate player that is available on the list.
Example: You win a game, you will be matched with a player higher rated. If you lose, you will be matched with a lower rated player. If the color alternation works great, if it doesn't not, then give white to the lower rated player, because the higher rated player already has an advantage.
To remove pairing errors, the pairing needs to be similar to a double round robin. If the players get matched a second time, the colors must alternate.
The two players that just finished their game, will not be permitted to play against each other until they have played two other matches with other players. Something similar to a round robin of 4 players. Only once the 4 players have completed their mini round robin can we know if a player must go up the ladder or down to the next group.
While waiting for the next round, a training puzzle could be shown. If the pairing is available the puzzle is shrunk & pushed aside for the game. During the game if a player wishes to do the puzzle at the same time as the game, they can, because both chessboards are on the same web page. One chess board would be smaller than the other and with a click they could alternate their size.
#14 Indeed, and I'm not trying to "defeat" this suggestion, rather I want to keep a dialogue open since even if a developer codes it, there's no guarantee Lichess would accept and maintain the code contribution...
Off the top of my head:
* The tournament clock would need to dictate the number of rounds; or the tournament list page would need to be changed to allow tournaments of indefinite duration
* The pairing algorithm, points scored, and scoring display would be different, as would relevant database indexes
* Tie-break rules for trophies could be different
* If there are many players and few rounds, accelerated Swiss pairings would be appropriate
and by no means is that guaranteed to be an exhaustive list! Swiss system is challenging...
Honestly I think direct-elimination and/or round robin tournaments would be easier.
What about a Monrad's Swiss system?
Maybe this is the swiss system that would work.
@toadofsky Round robins and direct elimination tournaments sound great!! Can someone create a separate feature request for those?? :)
Sorry for being rude, but I kinda hate how the Lichess devs don't ever respond to Lichess feature requests. I get how sometimes they are busy, but even if they see them, I don't think I have ever read a reply by a Lichess developer. But I agree, round robins, direct eliminations, and swiss tournaments sound awesome.
"don't ever respond"...
http://en.lichess.org/forum/lichess-feedback/swiss-tournaments-4?page=2#16Developers rarely call the shots regarding large changes.
