How To Be A Man In Chess

“ And I must agree with the OP when he said, "Take action against (sexual) abuse, misogyny and overall sexism in the chess world." This is a MUST.”

Then it sounds like you are both in agreement about what matters, the central point of Ono’s article, which is that we must do something to ensure chess is a more welcoming field for women. Whatever you disagree about is largely a matter of aesthetics and far less important.

He did take action by writing his article, and while I might have liked to see more concrete examples of what we can do, at least he did something besides taunt ‘beta males’ with playground epithets.

As for whether chess has a problem, yes it surely does as we have seen with the USCF debacle, and its leadership’s response to the Shahade incidents. My actions will include writing letters to the USCF board and Rex Sinquefield, demanding that they clean their respective houses. That’s a start, although it will take some dents in their wallets before they see the light, I fear.

@calmodee said in #11:
> “ And I must agree with the OP when he said, "Take action against (sexual) abuse, misogyny and overall sexism in the chess world." This is a MUST.”
>
> Then it sounds like you are both in agreement about what matters, the central point of Ono’s article, which is that we must do something to ensure chess is a more welcoming field for women. Whatever you disagree about is largely a matter of aesthetics and far less important.
>
> He did take action by writing his article, and while I might have liked to see more concrete examples of what we can do, at least he did something besides taunt ‘beta males’ with playground epithets.
>
> As for whether chess has a problem, yes it surely does as we have seen with the USCF debacle, and its leadership’s response to the Shahade incidents. My actions will include writing letters to the USCF board and Rex Sinquefield, demanding that they clean their respective houses. That’s a start, although it will take some dents in their wallets before they see the light, I fear.

Incorrect. When I say, "Take action against (sexual) abuse, sexism, etc" I mean WHEN IT TAKES PLACE AND IS VERIFIABLE. You said, "He did take action by writing his article". That's your opinion that "taking action" is writing an article. I don't believe that is taking real action. We all have our opinions.

"As for whether chess has a problem, yes it surely does" - Yes, chess may have a problem, but it affects 1% or less of chess players so it's a SMALL problem, as I said. That's the difference between our statements. Your statement leads people to believe that 5% or more of people experience some sexism, sexual abuse, etc, in chess. Again, the sexual abuse issues in chess affect 1% or less of players, so when it happens, report it and let the organization do an investigation. The solution is quite simple, logical, and stoic.

>Imagine the roles reversed. You turn up at your local book club, poker club, sports club and you are the only man amongst hundreds of women.

>Really imagine that for a minute.

>You might not go back, even if everyone was pretty reasonable towards you. Sometimes I want to talk to another guy, or at least not feel like the odd one out in the room. And that’s pretty normal.

I think that's a very unsual take, actually. If I join a hobby club, I do so in order to engage in that hobby. Now, socialization is part of that, but all I require of people in order for me to socialize with them, is for them to be people. That's it. It wouldn't occur to me to judge my company at the chess club solely based on their gender, nor their race, nor their size, nor any other phyiscal characteristic of them. If I wanted to specifically, desperately, talk to another guy about guy things, I wouldn't need a Poker club to find such an individual, I could just contact any of the men I regularly converse with.

If you want to strive towards gender parity in chess, the best way to do so is to stop being weird about gender in the first place. Let people just play chess, call out inappropriate behaviour whenever you see it, be critical about rolemodels, be against corruption and power abuse.
Taking things into this "Men just need to learn how to be REAL, MASCULINE MEN and respect WOMEN" perspective is just the flipside of the problem. Instead just try teaching 'people' to be 'good people' and you'll find that this works out a lot better.

If some person committed a misdeed, they should be prosecuted by the relevant authorities.

The only thing "systemically sexist" in chess are the privileges heaped on women at a professional level. There are tournament regulations and title regulations that specifically mention gender (i.e. women-only tournaments, prizes, and titles) and which systemically privilege women.

What kind of overall response should the chess world take towards a few cases of individual men behaving poorly? A bunch of self-castigating articles? Regulations that allow the destruction of a chess professional's life without proof? Even more financial privilege heaped on women? Or just the destruction of institutions in the chess world like the Saint Louis Chess Club or the USCF, because they failed to stop individual people's actions, or because they adhered to the fundamental Western belief "innocent until proven guilty"?

If you went to a book club, it is very likely you would find it almost completely female. Possibly the atmosphere would be annoying or oppressive to you because of this. So what would you have done about that? Prohibit people from gathering according to their preference? Many more men like chess than women, so chess tournaments are mostly male. This doesn't make women victims just by being in the minority.

Quick note that Jennifer Shahade has made a very good living from chess, far more than all but the top ten grandmasters in the world. She is a player rated around 2300 and as a man could only eke out a living from teaching children. Her entire livelihood is due to her gender.

"Thanks" to lichess to bring feminist agenda even for chess website. It was certainly necessary. After reading this bunch of misandrist clichés, I'm reminded that being a man today (not just in Scotland) is certainly great: it's the only category of people (so if they are white and "cis") you can hate with impunity. is it possible that you did not mention "toxic masculinity"?
Which problems women face in chess except that they are weaker than men in the game?
I'll probably find a less woke chess portal now (like as I've stopped shaving with Gilettes razors).

@ImaNubcake said in #6:
> Terrible post, imo. Must be coming from a beta male, I'm guessing? He was a man at one point in his life, but found being a man too hard (which MANY do) and became more emotional and less stoic due to the difficulty. Being stoic is a STRENGTH! If it were easy to be stoic, everyone would do it, but it's not easy, so not everyone can be stoic (keep emotions completely in "check"). Same as being skinny/fit. It's hard to be skinny and fit. It takes major effort. If it were easy, everyone would be slender/fit. But most people are obese/unfit.
>
> ------
> "Masculinity in Scotland, at least when I grew up, was celebrated for its harshness. The fight. The drink. The drugs. The sex. That’s what made a man.
> It took a long time for me to move away from that as I battled those stereotypes through adolescence and beyond. And I still struggle.
> All of this came at a cost. Depression. Questioning the meaning of life. Numbing myself with drugs. Isolation. Shame."
>
> Don't "struggle" or "battle" with certain stereotypes... EMBRACE them and learn how to master them like a real man has done for thousands of years. This is what real men should tell young men that are finding it too hard to be a man.
>
> We all have our opinions, and this is mine, so don't get emotional about it.

based

Please Lichess don't become woke, it's hard enough being a white bloke nowadays anyways without being told being a bloke is a bad thing. If i went along to a needle class and 99% of the people were women i wouldn't be surprised, i'd expect it, and i wouldn't want to change it to meet my needs. It's because we the 99% feel the need to adhere to 1% of the populations needs and bow down and change the system is why the world is in the state it's in. None of this gender crap, lets just play chess.

"You turn up at your local book club, poker club, sports club and you are the only man amongst hundreds of women.
Really imagine that for a minute. You might not go back, even if everyone was pretty reasonable towards you."

Struggling to think of a one reason as to why wouldn't I come back...

i like it and i am a boy stilll have a long time to be a man
doesnt anyone think
my rating is good for my age
[ am eight ]