lichess.org
Donate

Considering a move

As you get better in chess you're ability to synthesize knowledge of principles and patterns along with visualization improves so you can understand positions better and locate better moves more consistently. Good players don't necessarily have lists they dogmatically go down each position they look at because as you improve much of the position information is subconsciously acquired. I like how its described as move ideas seem to pop up on the board and your eyes gravitate towards them quickly. For example a weak player might consciously look at their king and surrounding pieces and squares and determine if its in danger or not, a strong player looks at the board and instantly senses danger to the king or not because they have lots of patterns and structural aspects ingrained in their minds that cue them in if the position looks dangerous or not for the king. A comprehensive list isn't practical and will always fall short of this, so rather you want to work on positions and structures, tactics and master games, and ingrain all these over time in your mind so that you look at a position and your mind filters all critical information of the position and you begin to think of plans and move ideas relevant to that. In the end, chess is hard which makes it so much fun.
Well, let the solution.

is a draw, but unfortunately white has 4. Kh2 +-

So, if you think like Kotov there's a dead end. But wait:

You can discard a move but NEVER EVER the idea. What if the h-file is open? This brings a stunning candidate into play which will never be considered as a candidate at first:

1. ...g5!!


You aren't budging, whatever. I'll just say this; #1 @phlegm , stronger players ponder different candidate moves; consider traits of the position (be it open lines, strong squares, etc etc), consider the current and potential threats in the position, consider piece activity and pawn structures to form plans and then calculate specific lines.

Whatever Sarg0n is saying, this is what I know I do myself, and stronger friends I have do as well. Not all the time, at certain points you are just calculating lines as you're in the middle of a certain 'tactical' line or whatever.

There is a lot of theory conserning how you think of your moves, you can read this and figure out what works for you. If, like Sarg0n, you only calculate lines, and you like the level at which you're playing with this technique, do that. You just need to be aware of all facets of the position you're in.
I immediately found 1...c5, but would never have found 1...g5. In a blitz game I would have played 1...c5. In a long game probably 1...h5 or 1...Qb5 hoping to save the endgame.
By the way, white is not forced to accept the perpetual: 2 Bc1 or 3 Bc1 stays in the game with still material plus.
In the game the really strong white player simply snatched the pawn and couldn't figure out what's the idea... Draw!

Sure, one have to consider strong and weak points. But not by checking a todo list, rather by moving the pieces in the brain and stored patterns. And don't be afraid of circular thinking, think of synergetic effects.

By the way, the things I mentioned here are not my inventions. Some pretty new books written by strong players tidy up with 200 years miseducation in chess. And this matches with the experience I have.

Thanks guys. I can see that there different approaches.

It seems that the stronger players quickly recognise a good/bad position before analysing the position more deeply.

I remember when computers were slower the chess master had the advantage because without crunching every possible position he was able to instantly recognise a pattern, saving him a lot of time.

I think jg777 offers a very good explanation.

I am learning lots from the ongoing debate. Thanks guys. :-D

There is no arguing with you (#15) and you're missing the points I'm making. I'm pretty much done with this 'discussion', since it's not an argument but a monologue from your part. This is why I was just plainly stating what I know, what I do, and what I know strong players I know do. You stating that you and a few writers 'just move pieces in your brain', is not an counter-argument.

I hope I've answered #1's questions, and wish him a lot of luck with improving his chess.
Thanks BeepBeepImAJeep. I appreciate your help.

I'm not familiar with the school of thought of Kotov or any of the other players mentioned, but I think I understand what Sarg0n is saying. I believe my thinking process is very similar. I don't have a to do list. I do repeat calculations, I feel like I catch more and more each time around and it helps me get a better understanding of the position. As tpr mentioned, I also often have silent dialogue with myself. Very cool game example, Sarg0n !

As for the idea that Kotov and others do not practice what they preach, that sounds very possible. I know that I've thought about taking this approach with students, but I do feel like a cookie cutter thinking process is not flexible enough for the complexities of chess.

Of course I do respect BeepBeepImAJeep 's views as well. Clearly his way of think has worked out well for him as an IM.
Thank you!

I don't want to cause a bad mood but in my opinion this is the wrong kind of discipline the old guys taught. It sounds good theoretically but it works by no means practically. Chess is extremely hard to teach so I can understand that the masters fail to describe their REAL thinking process. We see a position and the pieces start to move in the brain. Who doesn't do this when solving an exercise?
There's no todo list, the interactions are grasped randomly. My only advice is: enlarge your pattern pool, collect motifs, gather chunks from the masters. But do not try to discipline your thinking like Kotov by determining a few candidates, calculate them once (??) and then move (??). You will miss so much!

By the way, the example is courtesy of Jonathan Rowson: read the "sins" and "zebras". Then you'll have a better feeling what I tried to point out.

This topic has been archived and can no longer be replied to.