tournament policing

well i've shown 4/5 of the tourneys were won by a cheater, your minimizing is irrelevant, and if i go back farther there is more. you are wrong. its a problem. when 4/5 of the last tourneys have been won by a cheater, its an issue. its not the top 10, its usually the top 1 or maybe 2 in the leader board. most people are honest, however its crap that cheaters are winning the this many more than legitmate players. i don't have stress, this is the internet. i think this site is amazing, but it could be even better, so i'm trying to drive a discussion. i didn't ask opinions regarding if the problem exists, rather what to do about it, but your response is noted.

sheckley666 i don't quite understand your question, sorry. if you're asking if i think only new accounts cheat, then no, but the likely of a new account being a cheat is much higher than a long established one.

Paranoia is even worse. There is a basic noise of cheaters and no measure will prevent this in advance.

laser: you are definitely right about sandbaggers, which is a much harder thing to detect and police. that discussion is much harder to have, and is more of a behavior detection problem then a outright engine problem. however nearly 0 centipawn loss and matching engine moves 90% of the time is pretty obviously engine use.

the people who are caught instantly are usually the ones dumb enough to use the lichess engine to directly analyze their games. the ones that people use an external source are usually overlooked until it is brought to light, at leat in my experience playing here. i've never seen someone just removed while playing, but i believe it happens.

i probably get 2-3 popups a day saying a cheater i reported was banned, so i wouldn't say it's called 'paranoia' its more like 'being right' i'm am probably running well over 90% of the people i report being banned, i think only 1 in the last 12 didn't get the mark.

@rxd3ath My question refers to this statement: "reporting them has little effect since they just get a new name, and do the same thing once the old one gets a mark the next day."
What makes you sure that many of the new cheaters are in fact old (banned) cheaters who created a new account?

@rxd3ath you are completely over reacting. yes, cheaters are bad but there is no need to have a huge tantrum about it. You report them if you think that is the right thing to do and then you continue playing chess.

Maybe a more efficient solution would be to overturn the results if a cheater is caught afterwards (such as first place cheater removed and everyone else moves up a place) than to consider the manpower use for all the tournaments in real time.

@rxd3ath i was a very active member in chess.com until i point out erik (one of the founders) that cheaters are a plague in the site and one of the employers suggest me to shut my mouth (politely). i organized there tournaments almost everyday and well, i lost my patience when in one of them (16 players, 4 groups, 1 pass by group) in each group at least one comproved cheater and in the finals (4 players, 1 myself) 2 of them where banned for cheating. Well in that tournament (correspondence) about 30% were banned by cheating "before" the tournament ends. They have a good (maybe very good) detection system. Probably here is worst. And even so, this happens all the time, in every tournament.

You have 3 ways to solve it.

1) ignore, as that poor souls need it to feel good with themselfs and their miserable live. Play OTB tournaments, let this games work as a training.
2) report and hope, somewhere in future, they will be caught. But this sites lives from players, and... if you block register too much, the site will die... and again, not everyone are cheater... (despite they are far more than many people claims to be - just they aren't caught)
3) play in fide arena. they say they have the most state of art online cheaters detection. Who are caught is suspended/banned from fide. Can't reopen account again can't play OTB at least for a time, because, they are suspend/expelled from fide. Take lichess for training. If he cheats, he cheats. It is like training with stockfish.

In chess.com in correspondence games, it is unbelievable the amount of cheaters they caught. When you take this too serious it is almost depressing, i know, i felt it too.

@rxd3ath

I think many people care and are as irritated as you are. However, there's only so much that can be done. Lichess does an ok job getting rid of cheaters in the long run, but catching them 'on the fly' would probably require a massive amount of resources, and won't solve the problem of people opening a new account.

As someone said : "that's the Internet", so you have to face more infractions than in real life. Try play OTB chess where the ethical standards are much better if you really can't stand cheaters, or just accept that (admittedly sad) reality.

@rxd3ath In there there is a monthly report that refer the amount of banned players for cheating. They take apart the titled players, who are dealt with much more cautious in order to protect their good name. It is sad to see that every month more than a dozen are banned. And they are titled, with reputation to lose, people who love the game, study thousends of hours and should give example... even so, the temptation is too high, the risk of being caught too low...

How do you expect this "real-time detection" to work in the first place, even with massive ressources? Have Lichess hack into everyone's computer and webcam to see whether they are using Stockfish on another screen or smartphone or whatever?

Hopefully not, but how else?

Proper analysis can only be done retroactively, that's just how it works.