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If we solve chess, white can force win

Well no computer is THAT good to know all win, draw, and loss combinations...
Not yet at least...

Wow so many answers! Thank you! So it is interesting for other players too :) Of course if chess would be solved still it would be a decent game for humans.
BTW Antichess is solved but it is a different game mode.

EDIT* Also the one pawn advantage is because white moves first. And after a long endgame it could be a pretty huge advantage if both players move perfectly. White consistently wins slightly more often than Black, usually scoring between 52 and 56 percent. White's winning percentage is about the same for tournament games between humans and games between computers

It is speculation at this point. Alpha zero is going to look pathetic in 10 years just as greenblatt or kaissa or whatever existed before. If the day ever comes when we have the tech to actually map out all the relevant lines, Computer chess champoinships will die out. I do not believe that it will have any effect on actual chess since modern GMs are already pushing the limits of human memory and memorizing individual forced D/W will be a hopeless venture.

The start position is a zugzwang; Black wins by force.

@jux303

If people can remember the last sentence of page 126 of a 259 page book...
If people can memorize the dictionary...
If Magnus has 1000s of games stored in his memory that he can show you from start to finish...

...then it's completely unclear what the limits of the human mind actually are.



@Toadofsky

I got a chuckle from that.

That statement might actually be true.
I somehow doubt it, but it may possibly be true.

Simply the argument that white is forced to telegraph his intention, paired with the idea that every move creates a possible weakness, may very well ratify your claim.

If someone is prepared to say that "chess is a forced win for white", then they will need to prove that your statement is impossible.

While they're doing that, I'll be over here playing my next games.

Black wins after all. Suba‘s old joke: „Say a number!“ „16“ „17. I win.“

I don't think that white's tempo lead is a forced win, because as the games goes on, the tempo lead usually becomes less significant. As long as black doesn't create huge positional weaknesses, white shouldn't be able to use the tempo lead to win material and avoid a dry, drawn position.

Even if white somehow forces the win of a pawn (which I think is unlikely), white would have to avoid trading into a rook and pawn endgame which would become a theoretical draw. This would probably be difficult, because a chess game without mistakes by either player naturally trades into rook endgames because they are the last pieces to develop and get into the game. Keeping pieces on the board means avoiding trades, which probably means playing some conservative and passive moves that make it easier for black to achieve a draw.

I also saw an agadmator video on youtube that covered a game where alphazero played itself and it ended in a draw (although it was very dynamic and interesting game.) Alphazero is the closest to achieving perfect play, and I don't think that AI or engines will discover something new that will lead to a forced win for white.

Reconnecting